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Soon Fines Will be Cheaper than Fees

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Posted by: Zipp0

As a new rider looking for places to ride, it seems that pretty soon it will be cheaper to ride outlaw and pay any fines you might get than to go to parks and pay their ever-increasing fees. I'm not saying that I will do that, but as fees continue to increase, more and more people will ride where they please.

It just seems like it could spiral out of control.

Also, here in PA, why can 4 wheelers ride state forest, but not 2 wheelers? Do we need to organize and lobby more effectively?

Zipp0


Posted by: tnrider

you should try the lobby approach - esp since the fine is the least of your concern in PA. i believe they can confiscate the bike if you are riding illegally and if riding on a dirt road and you are nonlicensed (under 16) i think they can delay your getting your real driver license. they have some tough laws on this stuff up there... i have a licensed dual sport that i ride on the dirt roads when i am in PA and still get hassled by the MAN.

your problem will be the perception that atv riders are riding gently at walking speeds and motorcycle riders will be ripping through the woods at high speed. of course for the most part this is likely true although there are a few atv riders that exceed the PA trail speed limit (and i do believe there is one, something like 10-15mph).

your lobby effort may be better directed at separate but equal access - ask for some dedicated riding locations. i know the corps of engineers have one on the shenango valley river lake area off of highway 846 (open only in summer to riding). http://www.lrp.usace.army.mil/rec/lakes/shenango.htm looks like the area is "temporarily" closed now due to off area riding (another area closed due to abuse...)


Posted by: Zipp0

Quote:
Originally Posted by tnrider
they can confiscate the bike if you are riding illegally


They can try, but they just may have a gunfight on their hands. Literally. There is a thing called due process, and I've never heard of any motorcycle confiscations.

Quote:
your problem will be the perception that atv riders are riding gently at walking speeds and motorcycle riders will be ripping through the woods at high speed. of course for the most part this is likely true


I have never read any rule or law in PA pertaining to an ATV speed limit. Not on designated ATV trails anyway. I guess they may post one in some places. I actually think there is a misperception that fat tires do less damage than thin tires. Unless they have scientific proof, they are unlawfully discriminating against one rec use over another.


Quote:
your lobby effort may be better directed at separate but equal access .


As African Americans know well - that is unconstitutional.

I think maybe the root of the problem is that lots of older people(voters) ride ATVs compared to bikes. Well, I vote, and so do lots of you, so it may be time to be heard.


Posted by: XRpredator

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zipp0
. . . Well, I vote, and so do lots of you, so it may be time to be heard.

and if they hear you would rather ride outlaw than pay fees, that does not bode well for your lobbying efforts.

good place to start: Blue Ribbon Coalition -- http://www.sharetrails.org/


Posted by: Zipp0

Quote:
Originally Posted by XRpredator
and if they hear you would rather ride outlaw than pay fees, that does not bode well for your lobbying efforts.


I didn't say that at all. What I said was, that when it is cheaper to pay fines than fees - many riders will pay the fines.


Posted by: Mully

This is about the most silliest thread I have ever seen.

It's because of people with ideas like this; that the honest guy like me looses riding areas.



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