back break in air. any help with good ways

JD_MXRacer

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Nov 27, 2006
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High Lord Gomer said:
I have purposely landed front wheel first when kicked sideways in the air. My thinking, and it has worked for me, is that I can land with the front wheel travelling in the right direction and the rest of the bike seems to folllow it. When I land sideways on the back tire it tries (sometimes successfully) to slam the bike down on the "forward" side.

i do the same thing. i land front first just barely. then the rear wheel follows. this is only on a transition downhill like a double or table top. of i have to land on flat i land back wheel first though
 

whenfoxforks-ruled

Old MX Racer
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Oct 19, 2006
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If you are slamming the front wheel down, guess what, that is an off throttle landing or not enough momentum to overcome gravity! All the argument aside, landing on both is the best! Who has some time to steal some slow motion stills off some pro?
 

whenfoxforks-ruled

Old MX Racer
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Oct 19, 2006
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Dungey tried that move at redbud, off the ski jump! He stood on the gas and almost pulled it off, a little too much whip! What do you think would have happened if he landed on the front?
 

FruDaddy

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Aug 21, 2005
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I personally think that it would have improved is odds a bit (naturally he would have had the wheel pointed to where he wanted to go). Of course there is no guarantee that he could have saved it.
 

whenfoxforks-ruled

Old MX Racer
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Oct 19, 2006
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Merrillville,Indiana
Front wheel first, landing at the bottom of the ski jump, 4th gear jump, 100 feet in the air. Anybody want to try that, not me! That would be a life flight to Chicago!
 

JD_MXRacer

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Nov 27, 2006
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im not talking about landing nose first off a huge jump. only the ones with transitions like doubles or table tops. if you think your gonna land on the flat or land hard then land back wheel first.

but if its a smooth landing i think front wheel first is better. you can get on the gas faster. if you punch it landing back wheel first then that bike is coming out from under you. if you do it landing front wheel first it will help absorb the landing and get you going faster w/o flipping off the back. but thats just my opinion
 

FruDaddy

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Aug 21, 2005
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I can't think of a good reason to pull the front brake in the air. The rear tire is heavier which generate more inertia, and consequently a much greater effect.
 
Mar 16, 2007
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I did it today like twice at the track, it does bring the front end down a bit, its alot easier than pulling in the clutch and than tapping the rear brake as well. But I have heard its not a good thing to do.
 

Zenith

Member
Jan 11, 2001
483
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Unless nickman1209 is going pro I think we can pretty much ignore the supposed "lost momentum" or lost speed on landing if the bike stalls. Hitting the backs brake is an essential technique to learn to control the bike in the air, either in an emergency or on certain jump types where the front will always go high and needs to be corrected once you're in the air (I'm thinking of certain sypes of step ups here where you don't necessarily want the bike level when you take off). You probably won't want to do it on every jump, but it's the kind of thing that unless you're doing it semi-regularly you won't do it instinctively when something goes wrong. My recommendation is practice it and use it, just don't start aiming to take off nose high so it has to be used. It's not a bad habit to get into and won't stop you becoming pro in future, honest.

As for the clutch thing. If you're on a 4 stroke or 250 2 stroke you should use the clutch. These bikes tend to stall more abruptly and don't bump start as easily, so if you were landing on a slippy track with a 250f stalled the skid before the wheel starts spinning could be disasterous. On a 125 it isn't such a big deal, I tap the brake regularly and don't use the clutch. Every now and then it stalls but if you land safely it will restart with barely a jolt. No harm to learn using the clutch though I guess...
 

High Lord Gomer

Poked with Sticks
Sep 26, 1999
11,790
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The danger of stalling is more from the fact that if the front drops too low you can't rev the engine to bring it back up. On some longer jumps I've seen A riders alternate between tapping the brake and revving the engine several times during a single "flight" to keep the bike close to level.

Two reasons for not hitting the front brake in the air are that you cannot restart it spinning if it drops too low (though you can rev the egnine to counter that), and that turning the bars with the front wheel spinning allows you to move the bike around in the air because the spinning front wheel has gyroscopic properties.

Having said all of that, a rider much faster than me (Jeremy Wilkey) said once that he sometimes uses the front brake in the air.
 
Mar 16, 2007
471
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High Lord Gomer said:
The danger of stalling is more from the fact that if the front drops too low you can't rev the engine to bring it back up. On some longer jumps I've seen A riders alternate between tapping the brake and revving the engine several times during a single "flight" to keep the bike close to level.

Two reasons for not hitting the front brake in the air are that you cannot restart it spinning if it drops too low (though you can rev the egnine to counter that), and that turning the bars with the front wheel spinning allows you to move the bike around in the air because the spinning front wheel has gyroscopic properties.

Having said all of that, a rider much faster than me (Jeremy Wilkey) said once that he sometimes uses the front brake in the air.


its alot easier than the rear brake, i heard dont do it cause it will be a bad crash if you still have the front wheel locked up when you land
 
Mar 16, 2007
471
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so if I turn my wheel to the left while in the air it will move the bike? I dont mean off the face of a jump, I mean like midflight, lets say im flying perfectly straight. turning the wheel is going to angle the bike or what?
 

High Lord Gomer

Poked with Sticks
Sep 26, 1999
11,790
34
Yes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyroscope

A spinning front wheel does not want to be turned. When you turn the front wheel left, it moves the rear of the bike to the left. The faster the front wheel is spinning, the more pronounced the effect.

The only time I've been able to whip the bike and not land somewhat sideways was when doing that. On a jump that has you in the air for a while (for me, a 90' single-to-tabletop) I was able to take off completely straight (not turning or leaning on the jump face) and once in the air turn the handlebars to the left while also pushing the front end of the bike down and to the right. That brought the rear of the bike up and to the left. Before landing pulling back and straightening the bars returned the bike to a perfectly normal, straight attitude.
 

whenfoxforks-ruled

Old MX Racer
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Oct 19, 2006
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Merrillville,Indiana
On any decent jump, if your front wheel locks or stops in the air it will slam the front end down, even thinking about using it is extremely dangerous! There is nothing you can do to counter it either, just like killing the engine, you are along for the ride. That rotating mass called the front tire does a lot more than you can figure, till you lose it suddenly. Fortunately for me the days of close metal fenders and fork braces are gone, front wheel lock up was frequent! Even riding fast over jumps, you would be going over the bars before you knew it, and of course, here comes your bike to slam you for making it crash.
 
Mar 16, 2007
471
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so I was practicing shifting in the air, and also using the rear brake in the air today. When I mean to do it I can, but when it comes down to using it for a save, I still instinctively reach for the front brake. So question is do you guys use it for a "save" or on purpose most of the time?
 

High Lord Gomer

Poked with Sticks
Sep 26, 1999
11,790
34
When I rode a 2 stroke I had to practive it enough that it would be instinctive if the front end was too high and I needed to "save" it.

Since switching to 4 strokes, it is no longer automatic for me.
 

wolfgangg

Member
Nov 21, 2007
21
0
Anyone tried shifting gear down on two stroke to bring the front down ? MMM I wonder maybe it could help a bit ? I recon if it works it might be better than the back brake ?
 

High Lord Gomer

Poked with Sticks
Sep 26, 1999
11,790
34
Shifting down in the air might help a little on a 2 stroke, but nowhere near as much as using the back brake. Shifting down will merely slow the wheel a little, braking stops it.

Shifting up and pinning the throttle does help raise the front, though.
 
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