Death of the 125 - what will be the last 125 year?

CaptainObvious · Nov 20, 2003

I for one will morn the death of 2-strokes. I have been riding 2-strokes ever since they started to out sell 4-strokes back in the early 70’s! Back in those days most riders were reluctant to make the switch over to 2-strokes because they were too pipy, required special fuel and more frequent maintenance (all true, by the way). After a few seasons it was clear that 2-strokes were the preferred tool for off-road riding. The industry was booming with product (good and bad) and it was a great time to be an off-road rider.

Here we go again.

While ownership of a 4-stroke is inevitable, I wont be looking to trade or sell my 2-strokes. I like the way they deliver power, I like how easy they are to maintain and most of all, I love the way they sound and smell.

My guess is that the manufacturers will begin to abandon the 2-strokes in 2008. By 2012 parts will become hard to come by and expensive. By 2013 I’ll be 4-strokin. I‘ll also be 50 years old and just damn glad to be able to ride anything.

Within a season or two will see 150f’s that will replace the 85cc class followed (shortly) by 125f’s that will replace the 65cc class. Once again, it’s a great time to be an off-road rider.

XRpredator · Nov 20, 2003

I too will mourn their death, but I'm not gonna sit here with blinders on.

And 4 strokes are better anyways, so neener neener neener

super rat · Nov 20, 2003

Hey niki I know you have crossed over and LOVE your little thumper(LOL) but I'm sure I read that Short was riding a 125, even more reason to cheer for the guy. And yea the Honda's 125's have been slow for a long time. I got an 04 yz 125 in my garage right now (it's not mine). Have you thrown a leg on one of those yet? It's the best bike I have ever riden and I have be on more than a few 250f's, so there!!

Sorry to hijack your thread. I vote for right now!! I hate those stinky 2strokes.

Senior KX Rider · Nov 20, 2003

I love my two strokes :yeehaw: I am getting the itch to buy again and have all but decided on one of the diesel-pigs :eek: The money thrown into development on these machines has sure payed off. I do however know that there will always be a big bore KX with a home in my garage. As the thumpers continue to get better and the govt forces everyone to go that way I do have real concerns about how many riding areas will face the fight of their lives to stay open due to the noise factor. Seems that there are so many that give no consideration to how loud they are. It doesn't matter how good your bike is if you have no place to ride it ;)

kdxtodd · Nov 20, 2003

XRpredator, do you acually ride an XR?

Senior KX Rider · Nov 20, 2003

and I LOVE the smell of those stinky 2 strokes :aj:

lwsmithjr · Nov 20, 2003

From the official Loretta Lynn's site, in the 2003 Amatuer Nationals Yamaha was the only manufacturer to offer a 4 stroke. The results don't show if the rider was on a 125 or a 250F, but you can deduce that it had to be a Yamaha to be a 4 stroke. Below is a list of the number of places Yamaha held in the top 10 in each of the 125 classes --

125A Pro/Sport -- 2
125A -- 3
125B Stock -- 3 (overall winner was on a Yamaha)
125B Mod -- 1
125C Stock -- 2
125C Mod -- 3
125 12-15 Stock -- 1
125 12-15 Mod --1

Again, I have no way of knowing how many Yamaha's were 4 strokes, but it is obvious, even at the amatuer level, the 250F didn't dominate. Now you can probably chaulk some of this up to the fact that because of Yamaha's lack of Amatuer support, some of the faster guys were not riding blue (ie; Hepler, Millsaps, Gray, Sipes). But you would think that if the 4 stroke gave a guy a big advantage and he wanted to get noticed by the factory, he would use the bike that made him the fastest, regardless.

Now then, knowing this, I encouraged my son to move from a YZ125 to a 250F this fall. He loves the bike. Says it is MUCH easier to ride. But he has yet to match his lap times on his 125.

My $.02.

XRpredator · Nov 20, 2003

Originally posted by kdxtodd
XRpredator, do you acually ride an XR?

yes I do. For now.

kdxtodd · Nov 20, 2003

I thought 250fs werent allowed to race with 125s at the amatuer level?

kdxtodd · Nov 20, 2003

for now? you gonna go buy one of those CRFXs when they come out?

Jon K. · Nov 20, 2003

I have witnessed the death of the MX four-stroke in the sixties and seventies.

Perhaps I am now witnessing the death of the MX two-stroke.

Ho-hum. Pardon me if I don't get too excited; but I have seen it all before.

Make up yer minds will ya?

mxer842 · Nov 20, 2003

alright rat ill give you this, four0strokes and two-strokes are about the same after a lap, but the amount of energy expends is substantial in comparison to a 4banger. 4bangers may not be faster, but they are easier to go fast on.

2smoke · Nov 20, 2003

Yes....but there's something about a blue haze in the morning....and like Senior KX Man said the smell of pre mix......and its good when you can still show what a two stroke can do to people who consider them difficult to ride.
Here amongst woods riders its kinda like being a member of a small leper colony...but all our members are proud. Im going to buy another before they go.

OnAnySunday · Nov 20, 2003

Originally posted by XRpredator

yes I do. For now.

Dont worry, im sure they will just rename the whole XR line into CRF-whatever-F's. Gotta be MX trendy doncha know. :think:
Ive heard rumors that's what theyre gonna do -w- the 650R.
Gonna make it a "CRF650FRBRPBS" or some stupid thing like that. :|
B A R F ! ! !
Hey Honda, if yer listening, some of us LIKE the name XR.
(those of us over 13 years old) uh oh here come the junior flames. :ugg:

If they DO rename em all CRF's and i ever buy one, a graphics kit with X-R all over it is on my parts list. :laugh: (just to piss em off.)

OnAnySunday · Nov 20, 2003

Ya know, that gives me an idea.
If (I F that is) the 125 smokers are gonna be history, mebbe they should do a "special edition" CR125. Yea, after all this IS the bikes 30th anniversery.
1974 - 2004.
How bout it Honda, or the aftermarket plastics companies, how about a CR125R-M 30th aaniv. edition?
Silver / alum. colored plastic -w- the matte green stripe on the tank, mebbe an optional low-swept pipe?
Matte green number backgrounds? Might be pretty kewl, eh? :aj:

lwsmithjr · Nov 20, 2003

Originally posted by kdxtodd
I thought 250fs werent allowed to race with 125s at the amatuer level?

I don't know about Ponca City, but they do at Loretta's.....

Okiewan · Nov 20, 2003

The 250F's are legal in amatuers, as they are everywhere else in the 125 class.

dirty~d~ · Nov 20, 2003

I'm not so sure that 2-stroke 125s will completely die. I really don't see the Big 4 spending any major dough on redefining a market that at this point in time is slowing to a crawl, however, I don't see them doing away with a product that helped them along the way. In the event that they do decide to completely toss the 125 2-stroke in the trash bin out back then I'd venture to say 2008 is the earliest we'd see this happen. That's just my opinion and it's not changing. :cool:

mxer842 · Nov 20, 2003

just like the days of the 2stroke street bikes, their days are numbered. if the epa wasn't cracking down the big 5 would invest millions of r&d dollars to improve the current crop of 2strokes, but since they will be outlawed it would be stupid to piss that money away on a bike that will be illegal anyways.

Yogurt · Nov 20, 2003

Originally posted by OnAnySunday
Ya know, that gives me an idea.
If (I F that is) the 125 smokers are gonna be history, mebbe they should do a "special edition" CR125. Yea, after all this IS the bikes 30th anniversery.
1974 - 2004.
How bout it Honda, or the aftermarket plastics companies, how about a CR125R-M 30th aaniv. edition?
Silver / alum. colored plastic -w- the matte green stripe on the tank, mebbe an optional low-swept pipe?
Matte green number backgrounds? Might be pretty kewl, eh? :aj:

I actually like that idea, in fact, I second it! Oh well too late, I already got an 04 CRF250. I made the switch from 2 to 4, how 'bout you?

yzguy15 · Nov 20, 2003

Originally posted by Jon K.
I have witnessed the death of the MX four-stroke in the sixties and seventies.

Perhaps I am now witnessing the death of the MX two-stroke. 

Perhaps somewhere down the line the MX two-stroke will make a reappearance after "dying" like the MX four-stroke has?

firecracker22 · Nov 21, 2003

Originally posted by gwcrim
The tree huggers can have my two stroke when they pry it from my cold, dead fingers. :flame:

Originally posted by blackhawk468
NEVER!!!!!!!!! LONG LIVE THE TWO STROKE!

Amen gwcrim and Blackhawk, I hear ya. :) I may not know how to ride one the way it's supposed to be ridden but I feel like my KTM is made for me. The few 250Fs that I have jumped on here and there are nice, and I'm not opposed to four-strokes, but having something taken away from me makes me want it that much more--if they DO outlaw two strokes, I'm gonna hold on to mine like there's no tomorrow.

Originally posted by dirty~d~
I'm not so sure that 2-stroke 125s will completely die. I really don't see the Big 4 spending any major dough on redefining a market that at this point in time is slowing to a crawl, however, I don't see them doing away with a product that helped them along the way. In the event that they do decide to completely toss the 125 2-stroke in the trash bin out back then I'd venture to say 2008 is the earliest we'd see this happen. That's just my opinion and it's not changing. :cool:

Sister, you read my mind and beat me to it. Sure the 250Fs are easier for some people to ride and fit some people's preferences better, and have many advantages, but that doesn't mean that 125s are going to die out entirely. Even though the KX 500 is the only big bore two stroke left to the Big Four manufacturers, how long did the Honda hold on also? 125s aren't going away right away. The factories may stop spending gobs of design $$ on them but they'll still be here, thank God since they are a blast to ride.

gwcrim · Nov 21, 2003

I may not know how to ride one the way it's supposed to be ridden but I feel like my KTM is made for me.

Hee hee hee..... I'm so slow I gotta ride a 500 just to try and keep up!

How bout it Honda, or the aftermarket plastics companies, how about a CR125R-M 30th aaniv. edition?

My first MX bike was a '75 with the red stripe and perpetually dented low pipe.

Memories..... like the corner of my mind. Smokey, two stroke smelling memories of the way we rode...... :)

XRpredator · Nov 21, 2003

kdxtodd asked:
for now? you gonna go buy one of those CRFXs when they come out?

maybe . . . but it'll have to wait 'til they make a 450X

OnAnySunday said:
I'm sure they will just rename the whole XR line into CRF-whatever-F's. Gotta be MX trendy doncha know.

It'll still be an XR to me. Hell, if I get a KTM, I'll probably get red plastic and XR stickers for it!

kdxtodd · Nov 21, 2003

The 4-stroke mx bike died in the seventies, not the 4-stroke dirt bike. This is not like the seventies. ALL of the 2-strokes will die. hopefully some manufacture will step up to the plate and offers a clean 2-stroke, so we all don't have to ride a xr or crf.

Death of the 125 - what will be the last 125 year?

When do you think the big 4 (CR, YZ, KX, RM) will produce their last 125cc 2-strokes?

2004

2005

2006

2007

2008 or later

The 125cc 2-stroke will stick around for at least 10 more years

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