New Public School Curriculum

LaRider20 · Oct 25, 2001

:think We live in Louisiana, a state where education has never taken a front seat until now. Now I would say it's driving the damn car. In the last 3 or 4 years our school system has adopted "The LEAP test". The LEAP test is taken every 3 years; starting in the 4th grade. My youngest son is 6 and is in the first grade. Last year in kindergarten he was required to write his first paragraph on what he did the weekend before. What happened to learning colors and shapes, getting along with others and taking naps. Now in the first grade, on a spelling test after he spells his 12 words, he has to write a sentence making sure to capitalize the first word, and end the sentence with a period. If it's a SPELLING test then why is he writing sentences with proper punctuation? Our (my wife and I) new obstacle this week is helping him to identify nouns and verbs in sentences. This is %$#*&% first grade! My wife met with his teacher, and she said that the school board took what was on the fourth grade LEAP test and backed it down to what they thought should be taught in grades K-4. Now don't get me wrong I believe in revamping the education system, by why not just put a mountain in front of my son and tell him to climb it? Parents are already talking about holding their 1st grade children back a year if they manage to squeek through with a passing grade, because 60% of the time they are just plain confused.

If a 4th, 7th, or 11th grade student who makes straight A's all year long somehow flubs the LEAP test, guess what, they fail the school year. I don't believe kids should be graduating high school illiterate, and I do believe the LEAP test is a device to stop this trend, but man someone in Louisiana had their head up their ass when they came up with this crap.

I am really burning up over this .

I3laster · Oct 25, 2001

i agree

last year i had to take the leap test in 8th grade well my teachers are more lazy then me and woulent even bother to help me when i needed help on a paper or something but leapest comes and i pass it barley but one of the teacher doesent like me (because i have a tendency to spead my mind) and she doesent count my last absent excuse so i fail with 18 1/2 days and gota take it again this year louisiana is a grate state but the school systems suck by the way im from slidell ,louisiana

yzguy15 · Oct 25, 2001

You're telling me you passed the English part? Please refrain from using run-ons. I hate the thing about absences though, I know what you're talking about, and I don't understand it one bit. We have a similar test here in Texas, called TAAS. You take it in 3rd-5th, 8th, and 10th (if I remember correctly), and if you don't pass the final test by the time you're a senior you don't graduate. I dunno about all that new curriculum being applied to our elementary kids though. I'm glad they don't do that, that's a bit much for a 1st grader. That should be like at least 2nd and maybe 3rd grade stuff.

Jaybird · Oct 25, 2001

yzguy15,
It's evident that your grammer is lacking as well. Please refrain from flamming someones grammer when you have less than adequate skills.:)

Many time kids are pushed through school without the basic skills they actually need to pass. That is why you will see many students making exceptional grades, but failing tests. You said a mouthful when you said the education system needs a revamp. Many children have problems with basics like reading, yet they are funneled right on as if they don't have these problems. Many kids are recognized as having problems early on and they are given testing that may diagnose them with a problem like ADD/ADHD. This condition makes it hard for a kid to learn things. This condition also grants the public school system about $2000 extra dollars a year to "supposedly" add extra help for this kid. However what more times than not happens is that this kid is given "adapted" work, meaning he is read everything aloud. Even these standards tests like you are talking about are read to them. These kids may actually be bright in most areas of learning but simply cannot read. Sad thing is, parents who aren't involved with the kids schooling see good grades so they have no reason to be alarmed. Also the teachers get good reports because they have a special educational needs kid whos testing shows he's doing well. But the bottom line is, it's a farse! These IEP's or Individual Educational Programs, as they are called, can follow the kid even into college. Now the problems starts when these kids leave school. Who is going to read their drivers license test to them, or a job application?
I could go on and on about this because my wife and I have been fighting this battle with the public school system for years. We are winning, but we know thousands of cases arounds the country where kids are just not being taught properly. It's all about money it seems.:(

BTW, if you are a concerned parent and have a similar situation as what I've described don't hesitate to e-mail me and I can give you some great starting points. My wife was a special child advocate for the court system prior to us finding out about the public school special education debacle and they messed with the wrong lady when her kids experienced this. Lets just say that my wife has the number of the Dept of Edu. in DC programmed on her cellphone.:D

justql · Oct 26, 2001

One thing to remember guys is that educational decisions are usually a state or local level decision. So everyone's finances, etc are different. It is educationally sound to increase the requirements at the low levels in an attempt to increase a students success rate at the higher levels. Hopefully they keep it in reason.

JuliusPleaser · Oct 26, 2001

OK, You Asked For It....

Originally posted by Jaybird
yzguy15,
It's evident that your grammer is lacking as well. Please refrain from flamming someones grammer when you have less than adequate skills.:)

OK, class, let's examine the statement above.

First, we shall address spelling. "Grammar" is spelled G-R-A-M-M-A-R. "Flaming" is spelled F-L-A-M-I-N-G.

Punctuation is next. When using a word in it's possessive case, an apostrophe should be inserted to indicate that it is being used in it's possessive case. The word "someones" above should be "someone's".

Finally, in the last sentence, the use of antecedent and precedent is completely wrong. It should say "fewer than adequate skills", or "less than adequate skill".

My Grandmother was a grammar/lit teacher for 40 years. She taught me to read before I started Kindergarten, and I thank her for that everytime I open a book. Children should be educated early--it's like getting a holeshot..

Jaybird · Oct 26, 2001

Julius...did I once claim to have correct grammer?:think Hmmmm......

Ms. Badlands · Oct 26, 2001

my 2 cents...

Our daughter is a first grader in the Texas school system. Her weekly spelling tests also include a short sentence. The sentence is designed to introduce punctuation, capitalization and sentence structure. She does not seem to have a problem grasping the simple introduction of these items.

My mother was a 7th grade Reading and Grammar teacher for 30 years and she was constantly re-teaching 7th graders the simple concepts of punctuation. I don't see a problem with introducing simple grammar skills in the first grade. How else do you expect these kids to be able to understand sentences in a book, if they don't know what a " or . or ! means? Kindergarten teachers expect children to know the basic colors and alphabet BEFORE they start kindergarten.

Be happy that your school is trying to teach these skills early in your childs education. It may seem fustrating at first, but you will be amazed at how much more the younger kids can retain. They are sponges at this early age.
:)

JMD · Oct 26, 2001

YZguy, I think you write a pretty good post. At least, when I read your stuff I don't find myself trembling for the state of our young people's education the way I do with some others. :eek:

WoodsRider · Oct 26, 2001

Mrs. Woods is an elementary educator. She taught kindergarden in Pasadena, TX, first grade in the Chicago West 'burbs and currently is a K-4 substitute in Schenectady, NY. We've had many "over dinner" discussions about the educational system. One thing she's stated is students living in "lower income" areas often start school without some of the basics, such as knowing their name. Although she does not always agree with the rapid learning technique, in some schools it's needed just so students will be at the same level as those living in "higher income" areas by the time they reach fourth grade.

LaRider20 · Oct 26, 2001

We tried to get my son into the pre-k classes in his future school, but were told after a short closed door interview between a school representative and him that he didn't need pre-k. The classes were limited and he was far too, and I quote "well adjusted" to be accepted into pre-k. We were told that it was for children that had trouble being away from their parents, and children with learning disabilities. Being told this gave my wife and I a "warm fuzzy feeling" that we were doing our job and we felt confident that he would be prepared for kindergarten. Who would have suspected that my 5 year old child would be asked to write a paragraph from a previous weekend experience; not me thats for sure. Now in 1st grade he is being asked to do things that my 13 year old did in the 4th grade. If you are not going to give a child the benefit of the earliest educational start possible, then at least let the parents know what to expect in kindergarten. Just crack me in the back of the head with a baseball bat while I'm not looking won't you! Yes he knew his upper and lower case ABC's, how to count to about 30, colors, shapes, different coins, etc. before starting kindergarten, but sentences and punctuation, no way.
Like Ms. Badlands mentioned I am amazed at what he retains, and yes he is definitely a sponge, but my wife and I are tired of constantly teaching at home after school. Also I might add that we are definitely in the majority of parents that are having the same problems. Our child and many others like him are not stupid, just overwhelmed by the curriculum. BTW I'm NOT going to be happy that they are teaching my 1st grader parts of a 4th grade curriculum. Like I mentioned before, don't put a mountain in front of my child and force him to try to climb it. Be more realistic and start with a large hill. He is a normal child that enjoys being a little boy and doing little boy things, not a robot, or a pasty-skined little nerd that can't keep his nose out of textbooks. Flame mode still on....just not sure which direction to point it.

XRpredator · Oct 26, 2001

Hurm . . . Luckily for me, Predator2 is pretty bright for his age (blows my mind sometimes how well he can read!), but of course he still writes like a 6-year old. So far I've been pleased with what the local school system has done for him (mostly his kindergarten teacher). Since this is our first kid in school, I'm not fully aware of what goes on, and that's another reason I'm glad Lil' XRP is pretty smart (must take after the old man, eh? ;) ).

Anyhow, how about testing the teachers? I don't doubt that there are some exceptional teachers out there (heck, my sister-in-law is one of 'em!), but there are also some real slackers--mostly in high school. I think they need those "LEAP" tests. If they don't pass, they get "held back" (a pay cut maybe?):think

LaRider20 · Oct 26, 2001

Louisiana teachers are one of the 3rd lowest paid teachers in the nation. I wouldn't even whisper pay cut around here. Some teachers are frustrated as well. I know it's a state thing because there are still law suits pending around New Orleans where families are suing the the school board over the LEAP test and the new mandatory curriculum. It's just...very frustrating and I want my child to be well adjusted, happy and successful. I don't see any way around it, so we will continue to bucke down and take our lumps with other parents, while celebrating our successes and working on our failures. That doesn't mean I have to like it, or support it.

longtime · Oct 27, 2001

Sorry, La Rider, but I couldn't disagree more with your overall theme.

After how horribly our schools have failed so many of our students (have you seen the precipitous fall in our childrens' acheivement scores? Did you know we're not even in the top ten any more?), I am all for standardized testing criterion that can be applied to broad bases of schools. It's the only way to identify schools that are failing our children. Also a great stick (embarassment) to get the teachers motivated or, if incompetent, fired.

Now, I am not advocating balancing these societal goals on the backs of little kids (I have a kindergatener and a third-grader). So if you really think they're asking too much of a given age group, please let them know that. But then be open to their response. (Maybe they are at the right level, and your child is behind a reasonable curve?) And the teachers should shoulder much, if not all, the blame when children cannot perform up to basic levels. (Parental involvement, of course, is almost a requirement for children to truly exceed).

Hucker · Oct 27, 2001

I have had these tests all through grade school 1-6, 7-8. I can't believe the US (or is it just a couple of states?) is JUST getting into this now. It seems like the US is following alot of countries these days. I'm not out here to flame the US, but its something I noticed. After the 09/11 tradegy, I was blown over that a person could check their bag at the hotel. Or even walk right up to the gate of the airplane. In the Toronto airport, you don't get passed security if you don't provide a ticket. And you can't curb check/hotel check bags. I wonder why the US is just catching on to these things now?

Wierd...

LaRider20 · Oct 27, 2001

Woah wait a minute, I don't believe that children should just be passed to the next grade, they should earn their move. I believe some sort of standardized test is a decent idea to make sure this doesn't happen. I don't think it should be an all or nothing test. Perhaps it should count for a percentage of the final grade. Most of all I do not like the idea of any child being taught something that was taught three or four grade levels above his head the previous year. The way this was done in our area, if you had a 1st grader and a 4th grader, or a 4th grader and an 8th grader, and the timing was right, they would both have the same curriculum. What's up with that? What's wrong with taking three steps instead of jumping a full yard. Now my child is no Einstien like XRP's kid :p , but he's no dunce either, and I do want him to have a good education, but I draw the line at him being one of the state's guinea pigs. I and many other parents feel that this could have and should have been handled differently.

XRpredator · Oct 27, 2001

Originally posted by LaRider20
. . . Now my child is no Einstien like XRP's kid :p . . .

Like I said, he must take after the old man . . .;)

Hmmmmm . . . XREinstein? :think

bigcr · Oct 30, 2001

LARider20,

Have you considered the fact that the old curriculum is totally outdated and too easy for our kids? If they can figure out how to use a computer in kindergarten, then shouldn't they also know how to capitalize and punctuate simple sentences. As a former English teacher and current counselor, I can tell you that our kids are alot smarter than they are given credit for. We are still behind compared to some other countries but by stepping it up a notch, we can catch up.

bigcr · Oct 30, 2001

oops

Unlike former English teachers, they should also proofread before submitting replies.:scream:

LaRider20 · Oct 30, 2001

I agree with what you said, stepping it up a notch is a good idea. STEPPING it up a notch would have been a good idea here. I feel they jumped. Yeah I know, I'm twisting your words. Maybe they could have started with a second grade curriculum, or a mixed curriculum. Who knows they may have done the right thing...then again this is Louisiana.:p

JMD · Oct 31, 2001

What? Me fail grammar? That unpossible!

JuliusPleaser · Oct 31, 2001

Re: Re: OK, You Asked For It....

Originally posted by joe_427
The pot calling the kettle black. :mad:

The possessive form of the word "it," is "its." "It's" is an abbreviation for "it is."

Au contraire, mon frere! To quote Webster's Newly Revised and Updated College Dictionary (under the definition of "possessive") Jane's as in Jane's coat.

Try again. There is a mistake in my post, but you'll have to look a little harder.:p

<Edit>D'OH! joe427 is correct about "its". However, I AM correct about "someone's". 9th grade was a loooong time ago. :o

JuliusPleaser · Oct 31, 2001

Re: Re: OK, You Asked For It....

Originally posted by joe_427

Were you referring to your punctuation errors?
The periods and commas belong inside the quotation marks. :)

HA! NOW you're wrong. ;) I'm quoting phrases from a different sentence, so the commas and periods go outside the quotes.

My other mistake was mis-identifying Jaybird's use of a singular adjective with a plural noun.

moto1313 · Oct 31, 2001

Re: i agree

Originally posted by I3laster
last year i had to take the leap test in 8th grade well my teachers are more lazy then me and woulent even bother to help me when i needed help on a paper or something but leapest comes and i pass it barley but one of the teacher doesent like me (because i have a tendency to spead my mind) and she doesent count my last absent excuse so i fail with 18 1/2 days and gota take it again this year louisiana is a grate state but the school systems suck by the way im from slidell ,louisiana

I hope this is a joke-You passed the 8th grade??? What a waste. :mad:

a454elk · Oct 31, 2001

Damn, I'm afraid , to ,. post,., hear!?$ I feel lyke everyone iz,,. watchin me right this!! Actually, I want to thank those that are teachers out there. Believe it or not, they probably spend more time with our kids than we do. I believe they should be tested and I aslo believe that they should be paid more. I, personally, have never been a teacher, but I do spend alot of time at my kids school. (no, not at the pricipal's office!). I want to be a part of their education and make sure it is on track. I think that teachers have a major influence on my child's future whether it's good or bad.

Give them a break, get involved in your kid's education so you can say that you did your best to help, not whine about it after the fact! It's only my .02 cents, probably not worth even that, and I can only hope that my grammar was acceptable.

Elk

New Public School Curriculum

LaRider20

I3laster

yzguy15

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Jaybird

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justql

Sponsoring Member<BR>Club Moderator

JuliusPleaser

Too much of a good thing.

Jaybird

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Ms. Badlands

JMD

WoodsRider

Sponsoring Member<BR>Club Moderator

LaRider20

XRpredator

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LaRider20

longtime

Hucker

LaRider20

XRpredator

AssClown SuperPowers

bigcr

bigcr

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Too much of a good thing.

JuliusPleaser

Too much of a good thing.

moto1313

a454elk

Mexicutioner

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