No Marquett National?..

[Smit-Dog]

... So count me in for 1 new rider that hasn't ridden an enduro yet being there. A friend is going to start with me as well so you can probably chalk up two newbie riders.

If possible, I'd recommend starting out with at least 1 other D-14 enduro event before the LM. You'll be better prepared and probably enjoy it more. :nod:

 

[Steve St.Laurent]

Oh, I'll definately be riding in other events first. I plan on riding all the Michigan (and probably northern indiana/ohio) enduros next year.

Thumbs getting better very slowly Randy. I tried to get in to a doctor tonight to get it x-rayed but the doc left early. I'm thinking about trying to get out and ride this weekend and just see what happens.

 

[snowboy]

not sure where to post this. I would have benefited to reading this earlier, like I said in a separate post I'm new at this stuff. let me know if i'm messin' up, but i think it's still on topic.

Re: LM - last month, while our leaders were in Utah, some of us thinking out loud with ensuing discussion wondered whether to promote LM as a uniquely challenging enduro, see magoo's post regarding endurocross, erzberg, etc. or modify format and 1) make it just pure fun that we know the average C rider will enjoy and 2) make it a timekeeping event

Some of us are leaning to the uniquely challenging side... others are leaning toward the fun for all side.

Assuming we even get scheduled in, and I don't know where that is in the process... I, NOT representing the club, would like to see a discussion as to which way you would like to see this go and comments re: timekeeping/restart format,length in mileage, one course for all or extended courses for B, and A-riders, terrain preferences, and alternate ideas for unusual weather phenomena such as the rain in 2006 or the heat of 2005. If the point of all this is a serious exchange of ideas then lets really do it and be specific. Most of you guys are wise enough to have forgotten more about enduros than I know. So bring on the wisdom and in detail please.

I saw some really good comments, keep them coming with coherence and conciseness.

 

[snowboy]

Freaks You Out. Well Put. It Was My First Time Riding Rocks Like That, To Me It Wasn't The Rocks Themselves It Was Tired Mistakes I Made At That Point. I Thought Everything Else About The Race Was Great Didn't Think There Was Anything Difficult About It. Just The Damn Rocks!!!!!! Who Knows Maybe You Get Use To Them After A While. I Think There Was Too Many. The First 20 Were Fun, The Next 20 Weren't.

Riddick: (my intent here is sincere) please contact me if you would like tips on riding those rocks, come ride with us some weekend. In short it is ONLY about momentum, get on the rock with it, negotiate the rock with it, and for your safety sake, do not hit the gas or dynamite the skidders or you'll be on your head faster than 199(no insult intended to the FMX'er, merely a good analogy). I hear what your saying about the fatigue though, you'll want to flow sections like that, think smooth with least amount of effort, not like sand or loam where you can be as aggressive as your cajones allows. With granite throttle and clutch control are key. NO I don't use a the cheater tire(trials tire) I run the S-12, exclusively.

FYI: I raced it and was whipped by the end. We do experience the trail racing, just because you don't know who we are does not make your comment a fair one. Many club members that take a year off from working on trail, and they rotate, have raced that event. So yes we KNOW how it is first hand.

For story sake, my first enduro was in Newberry in 97/98 can't remember(it was my first racing experience), I was so BAD and badly fatigued and dehydrated by the end I laid in bed for 3 days afterward with Ice on my head for the migraine and my whole body felt like it was on fire.

 

[Fred T]

Pre-ride your entire enduro in one day to clearly understand and evaluate the experience you are providing. I'd think that if you went toward the Super Enduro you would only attract a select group of riders and attendance would be low and not cover expenses; but maybe I'd be wrong and the revival of the Blackwater 100 would be in Marquette. IMHO most riders at endruos are recreational racers that have jobs to go to and race for fun, so the races that are fun attract the most riders. Smaller doses of your most excellent technical trail would be fun for most every one. Again, just my opinion. I’ll be 52 in a few months and I just started riding enduros in 2004 seriously, 2006 was my second season. I’m not the average rider I guess but I like keeping time and thinking a little. I like the trail in enduros more than riding ORV.

 

[snowboy]

Pre-ride your entire enduro in one day to clearly understand and evaluate the experience you are providing.

Thank you for the response. I have pre-ridden it the day before and have swept the whole course in a single day, separate years/not at the same time, obviously. I always knew it was way intense. Nonetheless, your comment is well recieved.

 

[INCA]

Fred's comment covers the majority, as far as I'm concerned. Well written and to the point.

Young Ted

 

[barkbuster67]

Yes, well written FredT. You call it like you see it and for that I have great respect for you. (The following is not directed at FredT, and I know he wouldn't have taken it that way) As a Sandstormers member, I can honestly tell you that I did not help at all this past year with the LM because of all the negitive feedback from the previous year. I raced it instead. It is so much easier on the body to race the LM than to work it. BELIEVE IT I truley believe that we as riders, prefer the type of race that enables us to ride at our best. Meaning, ride the terrain that we excel at. Anything over 3rd gear scares me something silly. I just don't know how someone can think it is safer to go blitzing down trail tapped out in a higher gear, versus technical trail that must be concoured with momentum and smoothness. But that is me and that's just my opinion. (Oh, and I like rock, orange painted rock!!) :nod:
My other opinion, if I do make a club meeting, is to cancel the LM all together. I actually enjoyed the ride time I had this year without having to work on trail just so people can complain. Even if it is the core customer. I believe the LM provided a challange for people to see what they are made of. With the terrain we have to work with, the only way we could make our core customers happy would be to have them run around the plains all day. If this is what the core customers want, then all we have to do is sweep up the kids course on Saturday and run the same thing on Sunday.
Was the LM tuff this year? Hell yes, and I loved racing it!! Sorry. It is tuff even on a Thursday night ride. Or a UP 300(just ask Smit-Dog) I would rather see the LM remain a challanging event(and bring back the TIMEKEEPING) than to turn into just a nice easy Sunday drive. The opinion expressed is only mine and does not represent the Sandstormers. But my vote will be to cancel the LM, unless of coarse those who have compalained would like to volunteer their experience to become Trail Boss.

 

[Smit-Dog]

I for one will be very disappointed if the LM is canceled, or worst yet IMO, becomes a watered down version. :|

What I'd really like to know is what is the overall impression of the '06 LM from the people that rode it? The internet makes it very easy for a vocal minority to be heard, and propagate it to the point that it becomes perceived as consensus. It's a damn shame the AMA dropped the ball on the event survey feedback (good idea - poor execution). How about the Sandstormers sending out an event survey of their own? It'll cost you time and postage, but the feedback should give you more accurate and useful feedback on the event. I'd also like to know the real reason the LM is not a national for '07. "Scheduling conflict" sounds weak.

How many people broke bones this past weekend at Goshen, running through flat woods, wide open farm fields, and paved roads? How many got hurt at the LM running the mountain and rock sections? Other than my forehead gash and the guy who tore his ass on a footpeg, I didn't hear of anyone that got hurt. While we may differ in our tolerance for women with facial hair, I'd agree with Barkbuster on the point that "fast" event trail / farm fields is where you're really going to get hurt. You may bobble and fall over in a technical rock section, but chances are you're going less than 12mph. Hit a tree just right at anything over 15mph and you'll break some bones. Granted, you can get really screwed if you happen to slide off and down a rock section, where your only chance out is a winch. Did anyone look at how close you ran to the river/creek at Goshen? You'd have a bad day if you and your bike happened to slide off that 6' embankment.

Anyway... that's my rant for the night. Sorry I can't help out with the hundreds of hours of thankless grunt work in laying out the trail, but should you have an event in '07 (in it's true form), I'll do everything I can to encourage people to go.

My suggestion: Charge $100 a head, and limit the ride to only the first 100 that sign-up. I'll wear my '07 LM shirt with pride. Everyone else can run the Mini Moose.

 

[sanford]

Wow, I would call this thread "beating a dead Moose"

 

[snowboy]

Wow, I would call this thread "beating a dead Moose"

Anything constructive there?

 

[UP Magoo]

I for one will be very disappointed if the LM is canceled, or worst yet IMO, becomes a watered down version.

What I'd really like to know is what is the overall impression of the '06 LM from the people that rode it? The internet makes it very easy for a vocal minority to be heard, and propagate it to the point that it becomes perceived as consensus. It's a damn shame the AMA dropped the ball on the event survey feedback (good idea - poor execution). How about the Sandstormers sending out an event survey of their own? It'll cost you time and postage, but the feedback should give you more accurate and useful feedback on the event. I'd also like to know the real reason the LM is not a national for '07. "Scheduling conflict" sounds weak.

How many people broke bones this past weekend at Goshen, running through flat woods, wide open farm fields, and paved roads? How many got hurt at the LM running the mountain and rock sections? Other than my forehead gash and the guy who tore his ass on a footpeg, I didn't hear of anyone that got hurt. While we may differ in our tolerance for women with facial hair, I'd agree with Barkbuster on the point that "fast" event trail / farm fields is where you're really going to get hurt. You may bobble and fall over in a technical rock section, but chances are you're going less than 12mph. Hit a tree just right at anything over 15mph and you'll break some bones. Granted, you can get really screwed if you happen to slide off and down a rock section, where your only chance out is a winch. Did anyone look at how close you ran to the river/creek at Goshen? You'd have a bad day if you and your bike happened to slide off that 6' embankment.

Anyway... that's my rant for the night. Sorry I can't help out with the hundreds of hours of thankless grunt work in laying out the trail, but should you have an event in '07 (in it's true form), I'll do everything I can to encourage people to go.

My suggestion: Charge $100 a head, and limit the ride to only the first 100 that sign-up. I'll wear my '07 LM shirt with pride. Everyone else can run the Mini Moose.

Atta Boy, Smit-Dog! :cool:
With that post, Nick just might make you an honorary Yooper.... :boss:

 

[sanford]

Anything constructive there?

The saying goes "you are beating a dead horse". It means that someone continually talks about the same thing time after time after time. You may have a similar saying in the UP that involves a different animal than a horse. Hence, when the horse is dead, quit beating it. I thought how it would be funny to hint around that maybe we keep talking about the same thing time after time.

It is actually very constructive. Its my way of saying that the reason the Loose Moose is no longer a national is because too many people complained it was too difficult and they let the AMA know. A lot more people complained to the club. The club wants to put on a tough event, which is fine. However , dont complain about the AMA or the people that dont want to attend the event. There is only one reason the number continually decline at the Loose Moose, it's because the club doesn't give the riders what they want. Those that like the event will come back. I for one will come back, but one rider doesn't pay the bills. Put your ego aside and put on an event that riders want. And IF a rider so happens to tell the club its too tough.....dont tell the rider he is weak.

I am a firm believer that the Loose Moose puts in a lot of work for their event. They are a great group of guys and I just hope they listen to the riders and put an event on next year.

Anyhow, I'm guilty of beating a dead moose :blah:

I look forward to all of your constructive posts in the future! :)

 

[Smit-Dog]

Wow, I would call this thread "beating a dead Moose"

Don't mistake beating with CPR...

http://dirtrider.net/forums3/showthread.php?t=143305