14 mm Allen doesn't bottom.

WLKDX

Member
Dec 7, 2004
43
0
I just changed my fork springs and oil, I thought all was well, but when I went to tighten the 14mm allen on the bottom it just spins, doesn't bottom. Anyone have any idea what I did wrong?
 

bedell99

~SPONSOR~
May 3, 2000
788
0
Do you use an impact gun to tighten. I had that happen and an impact gun worked.

Erik
 

Braahp

~SPONSOR~
Jan 20, 2001
641
0
Why did you remove the allen? You didn't have to just to chagne springs and/or fluid. Take the fork off and hold upside down and slightly compress while using impact gun and it will tighten. The compressing will hold whatever is spinning inside there.
 

WLKDX

Member
Dec 7, 2004
43
0
I didn't realize that I did not need to loosen the allen unless I was taking the forks apart, until after I had the springs out. i did try to tighten it with pressure on it, just spun. I will try the impact. Thank you for your reply.
 

canyncarvr

~SPONSOR~
Oct 14, 1999
4,005
0
First off, be sure it's threading into something!. The piece the valve body goes into does move around inside the fork body. You should be able to feel the starting thread pretty well. You can also look up into the fork body to see where it's sitting..move it around with your finger (or some other object).

You realize that pressure applied to the spring will be felt at the bottom of the fork, right? So..once you get it lined up, compressing the fork will tend to keep it in place.

And...had I read this whole thread instead of skipping over what Braahp said you wouldn't be reading the same thing twice!

If you don't know what your (or whosever it is) impact wrench puts out torque-wise, I suggest you find out before you use it. This is not a place where more is better.
 

WLKDX

Member
Dec 7, 2004
43
0
The valve never came out it is still flush with the bottom of the fork leg, it just never tightens to the point where it feels tight.
 

canyncarvr

~SPONSOR~
Oct 14, 1999
4,005
0
Scenario#1:
You did unscrew the base valve from the cartridge. The valve didn't 'come out' because you didn't pull on it hard enough to get past the o-ring.

In which case you don't know now if it's threaded back in and you're just spinning the internals or it's spinning around by itself doing nothing.

Scenario#2:
You never actually got it UNthreaded (especially if you did it by hand with no cartridge holder tool).

In which case, with either the cartridge held in place (FRP sells a tool to do that, you can make your own (check CDave's site for instructions), you can buy one from Kawi--$$$) and tighten it properly, OR with enough force against the cartridge from the spring you will be able to tighten it..properly.

How are you doing this anyway? With the forks in the bike?

Take 'em out. Turn them upside down. Lean on the tube to compress it. Try to tighten the valve by hand. An impact wrench will help you in this case (read and understand the previous cautions about that).

If that doesn't resolve the problem you will have to take the valve out and find out why it's not threading into the cartridge.

You may well have messed up the threads to the point it won't thread in without 'fixing' the threads. That will involve some hand filing. (I doubt you have a dye to do that)

Of course, attack the valve with a ham-fist and a rattail file...and you will be buying new base valves!

Cheers!
 

WLKDX

Member
Dec 7, 2004
43
0
Let me be clear on this, when I removed the forks from the bike and inserted them in a pipe vise (with brass teeth) I was under the assumption that the 14mm allen had to be loosened. When I went to turn it, the cap and lower fork leg material was mashed together from rock hits. I turned the allen 3-4 times it felt like it loosened, but it never backed out. I then figured out I didn't need to remove the allen and replaced the springs and changed the fluid. The more I think about this the more I am convinced that unless there are only a few threads on that valve it must still be attached. I will try my 1/4' impact on it later to see if it snugs up. To respond to some of the other comments, yes it is my impact (I have a 1/4 , 1/2, and 3/4 and am familiar with the settings for each)) also I do have a complete metric tap & die set up to 34mm. Just because someone has never taken apart KDX forks doesn't make them completely ignorant. I will be getting a shop manual for this bike soon. Thank You all for your help on this matter.
 

bentbars

Member
Nov 9, 2004
17
0
looking at the tech manual, if this is the device that contains the compression dampner clicker, on the bottom of the fork, the exploded view daigram show that device is threaded. it gives a torque spec, and says to use a non-permanent locking agent (loc-tite?). so this does screw into something. checking the disassemble instructions it looks like there is a special tool that holds the fork "cylinder" from turning, way down inside the bottom of the fork while you torque it down. you might need this tool to torque that device back down. good luck.
 

WLKDX

Member
Dec 7, 2004
43
0
I gave it a quick shot with a 1/4" drive butterfly and it snugged, I was then able to tighten it by hand. Thanks everyone for your help.
 

canyncarvr

~SPONSOR~
Oct 14, 1999
4,005
0
I missed the part where anyone said you were completely ignorant.

You were the one with the problem. That means there is some bit of ignorance (not necessarily having anything to do with being stupid) that brought the problem about. It's not possible to divine knowledge on this forum (immediately, anyway) and so it is much safer to start at the beginning of things than in the middle.

The valve being 'retained' by bent-over fork material it evidently stayed put when loosened from the cartridge which means the cartridge moved instead of the base valve (that is intuitively obvious to a casual not-completely ignorant observer but is stated in this case to maybe reach beyond that margin). As mentioned, a cartridge holding tool or sufficient pressure applied by compressing the spring (maybe) will prevent that in the future.

When the valves are removed by necessity (slider replacement or revalving for example) try using something like a mechanic's scribe to 'form' the bent fork material away from the valve. Consider yourself lucky....if the fork was suitably compressed to overcome the restraint of the bent aluminum when you tried to take the valve out and you used an impact to wrench on it, you could well have ended up with a split, cracked or otherwise broken fork tube.

Glad to hear it worked out ok. Glad to hear, also, that you do not consider yourself completely ignorant. That's a good thing. ;)
 
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