2007 Final Year of Honda CR Line 2 Strokes

[Chili]

It's a Sad day for the 2 stroke lovers.

While much of the news from Honda's Las Vegas dealer show revolved around the introduction of new models, including the new CRF150R, one of the more interesting news bits was something that was announced to their dealers in attendance…that the CR85R, CR125R and CR250R, will not return for 2008.

Several years ago, Honda announced that as part of a green initiative that they wanted to eliminate two strokes. At the time, they were producing millions of 50cc two-stroke scooters for world markets, and were keenly interested in eliminating those from production. In the years since, they've been replaced with small four-stroke models.

At the time, production of two-stroke bikes for closed-course racing was still relatively safe, since there wasn't a full line of four-strokes offered, and keeping the two-strokes around still made sense. Obviously it's a different landscape now. Everyone on Honda's roster of MX riders is on a four-stroke, and the market has had a nearly complete turnover from two-stroke to four-stroke. Combine that with reduced customer demand, the desire to eliminate the two-strokes for environmental reasons, and you're where we're at now…looking at the last production year of the Honda two-strokes.

If you're a die-hard two-stroke fan, freestyler, or Schoolboy racer, we might suggest picking up your two-stroke machine before they're all gone.

Posted by: Steve Giberson
Uploaded: 3:57 PM / 09-08-06

http://www.vitalmx.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=256&Itemid=37

 

[chris82785]

which means the others will follow suit soon

 

[Crazymlh]

After all the talk of the 2 stroke being retired over the last year or so it still amazes me the lack of regular posts in the "Thumper Central" forum. This is comparing it to the amount of regular posts in the "2 Stroke Discussion" and "General Bike Repair" forums where the posts are mostly about 2 stroke bikes. Am I dreaming this or are most of the forum users riding 2 strokes? Or is it just that there are other such forums that "Thumper" riders frequent?

 

[Kevin003]

After all the talk of the 2 stroke being retired over the last year or so it still amazes me the lack of regular posts in the "Thumper Central" forum. This is comparing it to the amount of regular posts in the "2 Stroke Discussion" and "General Bike Repair" forums where the posts are mostly about 2 stroke bikes. Am I dreaming this or are most of the forum users riding 2 strokes? Or is it just that there are other such forums that "Thumper" riders frequent?

They all go to thumpertalk.com there are a ridiculous amount of posts there every day.

 

[WhiskythrottleKeit]

Yeah im in thumpertalk all day. The 2 stoke section is pretty darn large and thats where im at mostly

 

[john3_16]

The two stroke section is very busy over there...

 

[motometal]

I dunno...Yamaha and KTM still seem to be going pretty strong with their two strokes. If someone comes out with a factory 144 that could get interesting.

Does anyone know if the '06 and '07 CRs have/will have the same suspension updates as the four strokes? Are they still updating these bikes, or has it become like the 500s where they make the same bike year after year?

 

[trakkerman]

I see the big four all dropping 2ts. As long as KTM, GG, and Husky can keep up with the regs, its all gravy.

 

[mx547]

Does anyone know if the '06 and '07 CRs have/will have the same suspension updates as the four strokes? Are they still updating these bikes, or has it become like the 500s where they make the same bike year after year?

aren't the two-strokes still using the third generation frame? not that that's a bad thing, just not the same as the four-strokes.

 

[Okiewan]

aren't the two-strokes still using the third generation frame?

Can't recall the specific generation, but AJ said he is using the 4-T frames (CRF250) to make AF's, because they are newer than the 250 2-T frame.

 

[Britt Boyette]

It's not a shocked that Honda is doing this. I think that over time, other companies will slowly follow suit. Kawasaki dropped the 125 from the US market last year, no shock. Sales were way down for them in that market. Honda has been talking about this 2 stroke delete thing for a couple of years now. I think within five years, you may see the Green, Yellow, and Blue, out of that market too. In their eyes, it has to do with unit sales which equals market demand. No sales = no market. Dealers don't push 2 strokes anymore and some won't even stock them. Why, because there's more dollar per bike to be made on the 4 stroke. Dealers make more money by selling parts and labour than they do selling bikes. Why do you think they push service contracts so hard when you buy a street bike?

Next time you go to the dealer, play a little game. Go over to a 450/250 4 stroke and pretend to be interested in it. Get the salesman to spend a little "quality time" with you. Then, go over to the 250/125 2 stroke and see what happens. They will almost always tell you that, "yeah, it's a good bike but the 4 stroke will beat it everytime.". That will give you a better insight of why the 2 strokes are going away.

 

[motometal]

well of course, which bike will have you coming back for more oil and parts? Which one will cost you more for an aftermarket exhaust? I've seen new 125s for well under $4000, this has to be worth considering if it's being bought for a play bike or out on the farm, considering how much money could be saved.


I can see the 125s going away faster than the 250s. On the average track, there isn't near as much of an advantage/disadvantage in the bigger class.

I don't think anyone is being "forced" to stop making bikes, obviously that's the direction it's headed but I haven't heard of any stringent regulations affecting them, other than the green sticker thing.

It may not be as simple as it seems, because I suspect with the 250s, if it comes down to just one company left and they make a good one, they may still sell a significant number of bikes.

 

[Okiewan]

It may not be as simple as it seems, because I suspect with the 250s, if it comes down to just one company left and they make a good one, they may still sell a significant number of bikes.

I'm sure KTM won't mind being the only source for a 2-T 250.

 

[DWreck]

I'm sure KTM won't mind being the only source for a 2-T 250.

I just read something about KTM saying that they are fully committed to their two strokes. Considering that filling niches is what got them to where they are today I believe that it is more than just talk.

As stated above if there are only a few companies to still make them I would think that those companies could make a pretty good profit doing so.

Who knows this might help Gas Gas grab a larger share of the market.

 

[+30]

Although I like honda, I dont think Ill be going after their last 2t. Sounds like KTM is has the right idea, I think I may be going orange next year. :cool:

 

[Rcannon]

This will also allow them to price the 4 strokes liek they want to price them. I think the two strokes have kept the price down.

Within a few years we should see a 10k dirt bike.

 

[motometal]

I hear you there. I will be torn between buying the last year CR250 (I love my '03), or saying "screw Honda" and buying something else. I feel like I have the rest of my riding years to mess with four strokes, so why not enjoy the 2s while I still can. KTM has an absolutely awesome 250/300 motor, but I never seem to be 100% comfortable with the handling and rear shock. I'd wish I could ride one that has been revalved by MX Tech and set up for my weight. I've ridden CRs so much that no other bike feels quite right in the handling department, even after I get used to it.

 

[evenslower]

Who knows this might help Gas Gas grab a larger share of the market.

That's just crazy talk right there. :p

 

[DWreck]

That's just crazy talk right there. :p

I knew I was setting myself up there. :)

 

[Britt Boyette]

Although I like honda, I dont think Ill be going after their last 2t. Sounds like KTM is has the right idea, I think I may be going orange next year. :cool:

You may want to consider going Blue. Unless you want the XC with the wide ratio gear box, the YZ250 is the best thing going. My choice is to hang with what I have. You can rebuild them and bling them out for less than a new bike purchase price.

 

[Micahdawg]

I am floored.

My dad bought me a 1990 XR100 brand new from a very small dealer in southern Illinois "Glodich Honda" when I was a kid. I decided some time last year that if the big "ban" every did come through, I would really like to go visit Glodich and order the last year Honda CR250. Well.....I'm pretty shocked to be reading this because I wasn't exactly expecting it to be the 07 lineup!!!

I've been on RM250's for my last two bikes (1997, 2001) and like them perfectly fine I know Honda builds quality, I know the clutch would be way better, and I really liked the electronic power valve (mechanical simplicity). That is why I wanted to switch back to Honda.

Having read this though....I'm utterly pissed. I heard they were dropping the 85/125 and figured my years were numbered, but this is just too much to take. And I'm pretty bitter about it. First, it'll be hard to scratch up $6K in less than a year. Second, I just got my RM dialed in and planned on at least a year or two more of ownership.

I hate to say it, but Orange NEVER looked so good. Right when I found out about Honda scratching the 125, I learned of KTM building a 144. If KTM wants to embrace the two stroke while we watch the big 4 jump ship....then by all means I'll proudly buy a brand new 250SX.

Rant off.

Micah

 

[Tiger]

2 strokes are too dirty for green Honda...

I love how they cited "environmental" reasons! :)

The only reason they are stopping is because BIG H demands BIG sales. Kinda like McDonalds or Toyota. :yell:

KTM is in a good position here to pick up more Red Riders though! :cool:

 

[APBT]

I love how they cited "environmental" reasons! :)



This really makes me laugh as Yamaha produces thier High Pressure Direct Injection (HPDI) 2 stroke fuel injection system for it's outboard motors and brags that it has earned California C.A.R.B. 2-star certification for low emissions. Time for the manufacturers to get off their rear ends and produce a fuel injected 2 stroke- especially in light of the fact that Yamaha already does- for fishermen!!!!!!

 

[mtk]

The "environmental" reasons are primarily marketing, no more and no less.

They sell more cars to Sierra Club members than they sell bikes to us.

 

[endofsilence808]

i have no complaints on my new yz250 two stroke but the honda 2 strokes are not much better then your 03 they havent changed them in forever. its a bummer and the price is gonna make it a sport that fewer people will be able to do, moto wise anyways.