Carb needle retainer removal tips?

Colorado Mike · Jul 16, 2004

So I've been adjusting the jetting on my new KDX 220 quite a bit, and the nut that holds the needle in is now seized. I've been very careful in not cross-threading it, but never applied anti-sieze compound to the threads as has been recommended in this forum. :bang: Now the thing is stuck bad, and the nut portion rounds off when I put my 6mm socket on it. Has anyone been through this and gotten it out? I am thinking of filing a groove in the top to put a big flat-blade screwdriver into, and then if it snaps, drilling it and trying an easy-out. The metal is crap to begin with, I just would like to be able to salvage the slide since that costs $60.00 :yikes:

Thanks for any tips,
Mike.

BRYDEN1 · Jul 16, 2004

Have you tried tapping on the nutdriver with a hammer as you turn it? It helps to have three hands, hold the slide and firmly push the nutdriver onto the bolt head. Gently turn and tap at the same time. Good Luck!! :cool:

Colorado Mike · Jul 16, 2004

Nope, haven't tried tapping. I think I'm going to hold off till after my ride on Sunday. I was also thinking of trying to chuck the nut in my drill press and twist it out, but there isn't much clearance inside the slide. Keihin should think about upping the price of this $7.00 nut by 2 cents and make it out of some quality material.

Mike

Nice Guy Eddie · Jul 16, 2004

A buddy of mine (aircraft mechanic) says that Sears makes this socket for taking out stripped hex heads... he says it works like a charm... (picture an easy-out that is indside out... spiraled inside the socket like an easy-out... so as you turn counter-clock it locks down harder)... he says it works pretty darm good (he uses it for rusty old suspension bolts)....

tapping will usually help (use a 6pt socket)... try spraying with penetrating oil and let it sit a bit first

BRYDEN1 · Jul 16, 2004

I don't think the extracter your talking about will work because the head of the bolt is so short. Use a good quality socket that isn't rounded off. Definetly use a six point. Twelve point sockets have two uses-- twelve point fasteners and rounding off tight six points.

shr · Jul 17, 2004

Colorado Mike,

Sorry to say this, but it sounds like you have over tightened one to many times.... or you have not been using a six sided 6 mm socket or nut driver as Bryden1 said. These parts do not need to have a heavy torque only just snug. It is not a flaw in material or design...., it's just knowing how to use the design.

At this point, I would suggest cutting a slot (as you mentioned) and holding the slide in a vice (padded with shop rags) and using a flat blade screw driver to turn it out. You may want to tape the screw driver with a mallet as you turn counter clock wise.

I think if you get the cable stay/NJ holder out, the slide will be ok. The holder is more of a pot metal as is the slide, but the slide has some plating on it that will hopefully be stronger that the holder. In fact the threads on holder will probably be ok too.....

Note; I have seen this problem more that once and it has always been over tighten and or not using a 6 point 6 mm driver.

Just my opinion, thank you.

Colorado Mike · Jul 17, 2004

Thanks for the suggestions, for the record I was using a new 6mm 6 point socket. Obviously I over-tightened it, cuz it's stuck now. But I do think the metal is way too soft. The nut seems like over kill anyway, but I guess I'm just used to the old Mikunis on my older KDX and Yamahas. They just had a plate on top of the needle that was held down by the throttle spring. Seemed pretty simple and effective. I'll let you know how it goes.

Thanks,
Mike.

Colorado Mike · Jul 18, 2004

Well, I got it off there. I cut a groove in it with a metal cutting blade from a sabre saw (by hand) and used a screw driver. I think tapping the handle with a hammer helped a lot.

Thanks for the tips,
Mike.

JasonWho · Jul 18, 2004

hunter1 · Jul 19, 2004

Had a similar problem with mine, I ended up using a 5.5mm socket with a little filing on the nut head. This size does fit better on the nut, someone did say that the nut is actually 5.5mm.

JasonWho · Jul 19, 2004

canyncarvr · Jul 19, 2004

re: '..but never applied anti-sieze compound to the threads as has been recommended in this forum.'

Things that make you go Hhhmmmm.....?

It's not so much that the metal is junk (which it is) but the thing is hollow to receive the throttle cable.

re: overtightened

Curious...what shape are your seat fasteners in?

I know kdx'rs that have stripped or broken the seat bolts within the first couple of times taking the seat off. My bike is over four years old and the seat fasteners are fine.

Why would that be? :think:

The needle retainer nut is recessed in the slide. Getting a groove cut in the thing with it still in the slide would be a pita. Glad to hear you got yours out OK.

I've not priced one from kawi. They're only $7? Wow! I paid more than that (each) for the simple locking nuts for a KX250 I use on my devol pull rods.

Colorado Mike · Jul 19, 2004

Canyn,
Sudco has the cable retainer for $7.72 not sure they can ship to the lake you walk on though.

Mike.

canyncarvr · Jul 19, 2004

Good grief! Don't get your panties in a bunch. It stands to reason that, having read posts that advise using a non-stick agent on the needle retainer threads and not doing it, a bit of raised eyebrow as to the sense of it all should be expected.

To then take exception to such is just plain silliness.

Maybe your walking on water comment is merely your sense of humor.

Thanks for the $$ verification. I need to order one to keep as a spare.

The only lake I would be walking on would be about 1/4" deep. ;)

The point (in case you missed it) is this: Finding your retainer stuck and knowing it's (mostly) an overtightening problem it would do you well to consider other fasteners on the bike. Indeed, the tightening of fasteners in general.

I made a point of it because it seems common that folks that overtighten things do so habitually, breaking/sticking one fastener after the other. There seems to be no linkage in their thinking between ham-fisting wrenches and the resulting problems/damage they cause.

If the shoe fits, wear it. If not, toss it in that lake.

Cheers!

skipro3 · Jul 19, 2004

Colorado Mike said:
Canyn,
Sudco has the cable retainer for $7.72 not sure they can ship to the lake you walk on though.

Mike.

LOL :eek:
Next time warn a guy. I almost had milk come out my nose on that one.

Colorado Mike · Jul 19, 2004

Canyn,
My panties are fine, guess I should have smiled on that lake comment ;) . Just in jest my friend.

Mike.

dsndblm · Jul 19, 2004

Some of you guys might think I’m nuts but, I coat my retainer with a tiny amount of anti-seize compound. I have had two of the retainers stuck in my slide and I don’t tighten them all that tight. I think it is more of a dissimilar metal corrosion than over tightning in some cases. :clue:

canyncarvr · Jul 19, 2004

Co Mike:

Got it 5by5 ;)

dsnd:
You got it. That's the point.

...you may indeed still be nuts!

Just 'cuz you're paranoid doesn't mean they all AREN'T out to get you.

;)

dsndblm · Jul 19, 2004

Just 'cuz you're paranoid doesn't mean they all AREN'T out to get you.

;)[/QUOTE]
carvr,

Thats my all time favorite line from TV

Frank Burns, Mash, Circa 1975
"I'm not paranoid, it's just that you are all out to get me". :laugh:

Well, back to the bike stuff! : :cool:

John Harris · Jul 20, 2004

I really liked the part about CC walking on water! The way I heard it he never got his KDX stuck or even got his feet wet riding it. Amazing what maturity will do with folks. Ride on John

Carb needle retainer removal tips?

Colorado Mike

BRYDEN1

Colorado Mike

Nice Guy Eddie

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BRYDEN1

shr

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Colorado Mike

Colorado Mike

JasonWho

hunter1

JasonWho

canyncarvr

Colorado Mike

canyncarvr

skipro3

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Colorado Mike

dsndblm

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