I was wondering what some of you guys think of this. I noticed at the Ironman GNCC this year that there was many C class riders in the morning race, who had full blown pit crews. I saw several who had dry break fuel tanks and 3-4 man pit crews. I watched these riders and they were not even close to a beginner. I was moved to big A HS in dist 17 after winning big B in 2000. I rode the Vet A at the Ironman and after the race I checked my times against the Big B class. I would have got smoked in every B class there was. When going to a national should you drop down a class to have a prayer or is it just easier for sandbaggers, because they did not ask to see my district card. I just race for fun and dont want to sandbag but I plan on doing more nationals (GNCC and HS) next year and was wondering what is normal as far as class's go.
Classes, Nat's compared to district
- Thread starter jsned
- Start date
There's some sandbagging if you simply look at the classes. Remember, these are "nationals": WORCS, GNCC, Nat. Hare Scrambles, etc. and you will find a much higher caliber rider here. In some cases your local AA rider may ride 250A in the GNCC. An A rider might drop down to B and so on...its not as much sandbagging as it is being able to compete.
scrambler220
Member
- Mar 3, 2000
- 92
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The biggest problem with C class sandbaggers in the GNCC is that the C class runs for 2 hours. If you run B or higher (except super senior) you go for 3 hours. There are a lot of local pro's, and A's, that end up racing C class because they don't want to race for 3 hours. The guy that won the GNCC 250 C class this year just raced in the pro class at one of our local races last weekend, and had a decent finish. I've always raced C in GNCC, but based on lap times, I would place higher in the B class...that's where I'm headed next year.
- Thread starter
- #4
DrtSqrt
that is what I was asking about.( Is it normal to drop down a class at the national races). Like I said I just race to have fun but after I paid more attention this year I noticed how it looked like some had dropped a class or two, or three.
Scrambler220
I just dont get why someone would ride C class if they are not a beginner, or are even alittle serious about racing. I would rather get top 7 in B than 1st in the C class, unless I was a beginner.
that is what I was asking about.( Is it normal to drop down a class at the national races). Like I said I just race to have fun but after I paid more attention this year I noticed how it looked like some had dropped a class or two, or three.
Scrambler220
I just dont get why someone would ride C class if they are not a beginner, or are even alittle serious about racing. I would rather get top 7 in B than 1st in the C class, unless I was a beginner.
Timr
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- Jul 26, 1999
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Unfortunately, There's a lot of this dropping down (sandbagging) that goes on. I think it's total crap! You shouldn't have guys in the C class who can finish in the Top 40 Overall. The only riders that are allowed to drop down are local AA to the A class. That's it! If you ride B in your local series, you're supposed to ride B.
I rode the opening round at Ock. Fla two years ago. At the sign up for the C race, they were anouncing that they had a list of all SETRA and FTR B riders for both Hare Scrambles and Enduros. If you signed up for C and the found your name on one of those lists, they said that they would turn you into the AMA and you could have your AMA card suspended for a year.
They should be doing this at every race. However, they have a lot of other things to deal with without trying to focus on people signing up for the wrong class.
The proper way to do it is to ride 2 races in the class that you belong in and if you aren't competitive, you petetion the GNCC to move you down a class based on lap times and finishing positions. Here's the class rules from the GNCC site:
RIDER ELIGIBILITY AND CLASSIFICATION
Pro Classification
1. Top ten overall riders from previous year's GNCC series, unless eligible for age class. This applies to Motorcycles and ATVs.
2. Top ten AA AMA National Hare Scrambles riders.
3. Top ten overall riders from the AMA National Enduro, Reliability Enduro, and Hare & Hound Series from the previous year. All current AMA Professional license holders from all types of Off-Road Competition.
4. All international riders that currently hold a top ten ranking in their home country's National Championship of similar type of event.
5. All riders from the previous year that were chosen members of the World ISDE Trophy Team.
6. All riders from the previous year that earned Gold Metals at the ISDE.
7. Any rider holding an AMA Pro Sport license who qualified for an Outdoor National Motocross or Supercross in the current or previous year.
A Classification
1. All riders in the top ten overall ranking in any regional or state Hare Scramble Series sanctioned by the AMA.
2. All B riders ranked in the top three of their class in the previous year's GNCC series. They must have won at least four races during the previous year. Age divisions are explained below. For 2002, the top ranked rider must advance to A.
3. All riders that have ever qualified for the ISDE.
4. All riders that have an A ranking in any other off-road series.
5. Age Divisions - B riders winning four or more races during the season must move to A division the following season.
B Classification
1. All riders wishing to enter an event that do not qualify for the C class and also do not meet the qualifications for placement in the A and Pro classes.
2. All C riders ranked in the top five of their class in the previous year's GNCC series.
3. All riders that have a B ranking in any other off-road series.
4. If a B rider places in the top twenty overall at any given event, they will be moved to the A class the following event.
C Classification
Novice riders not ranked in the top five of their class in any other off-road series.
Moving within Classifications
A rider may not move from an upper classification back to a lower classification if they have participated in more than two events in the upper classification during the season. A rider may request to move back to a lower classification based on class finishes and time differences.
I rode the opening round at Ock. Fla two years ago. At the sign up for the C race, they were anouncing that they had a list of all SETRA and FTR B riders for both Hare Scrambles and Enduros. If you signed up for C and the found your name on one of those lists, they said that they would turn you into the AMA and you could have your AMA card suspended for a year.
They should be doing this at every race. However, they have a lot of other things to deal with without trying to focus on people signing up for the wrong class.
The proper way to do it is to ride 2 races in the class that you belong in and if you aren't competitive, you petetion the GNCC to move you down a class based on lap times and finishing positions. Here's the class rules from the GNCC site:
RIDER ELIGIBILITY AND CLASSIFICATION
Pro Classification
1. Top ten overall riders from previous year's GNCC series, unless eligible for age class. This applies to Motorcycles and ATVs.
2. Top ten AA AMA National Hare Scrambles riders.
3. Top ten overall riders from the AMA National Enduro, Reliability Enduro, and Hare & Hound Series from the previous year. All current AMA Professional license holders from all types of Off-Road Competition.
4. All international riders that currently hold a top ten ranking in their home country's National Championship of similar type of event.
5. All riders from the previous year that were chosen members of the World ISDE Trophy Team.
6. All riders from the previous year that earned Gold Metals at the ISDE.
7. Any rider holding an AMA Pro Sport license who qualified for an Outdoor National Motocross or Supercross in the current or previous year.
A Classification
1. All riders in the top ten overall ranking in any regional or state Hare Scramble Series sanctioned by the AMA.
2. All B riders ranked in the top three of their class in the previous year's GNCC series. They must have won at least four races during the previous year. Age divisions are explained below. For 2002, the top ranked rider must advance to A.
3. All riders that have ever qualified for the ISDE.
4. All riders that have an A ranking in any other off-road series.
5. Age Divisions - B riders winning four or more races during the season must move to A division the following season.
B Classification
1. All riders wishing to enter an event that do not qualify for the C class and also do not meet the qualifications for placement in the A and Pro classes.
2. All C riders ranked in the top five of their class in the previous year's GNCC series.
3. All riders that have a B ranking in any other off-road series.
4. If a B rider places in the top twenty overall at any given event, they will be moved to the A class the following event.
C Classification
Novice riders not ranked in the top five of their class in any other off-road series.
Moving within Classifications
A rider may not move from an upper classification back to a lower classification if they have participated in more than two events in the upper classification during the season. A rider may request to move back to a lower classification based on class finishes and time differences.
- Thread starter
- #6
Timr
why dont they just require to see a district card at the nationals for at least the B and C class. I know maybe some guys dont ride any district but that seems to be the easiest way for the people running a national to keep it fair basically all they have to do is ask to see the card which the district takes all the work in getting riders their cards. Isnt it amazing how far people will go to get ahead, even in something that is suppose to be a sport. I think district 17 is pretty good at their HS organization, seems to be very fair, dont know about motocross or the others. I guess you just have to expect a certain amount of crap anymore.
why dont they just require to see a district card at the nationals for at least the B and C class. I know maybe some guys dont ride any district but that seems to be the easiest way for the people running a national to keep it fair basically all they have to do is ask to see the card which the district takes all the work in getting riders their cards. Isnt it amazing how far people will go to get ahead, even in something that is suppose to be a sport. I think district 17 is pretty good at their HS organization, seems to be very fair, dont know about motocross or the others. I guess you just have to expect a certain amount of crap anymore.
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