MX Start gate technique?

SpectraSVT · Jun 7, 2004

I tried search but starts and starting pull up all kinds of posts that I didn't need...so I'll try asking.

I am really bad at starts. Mostly getting out of the gate. I seem to be fine after I get going. I don't really know what technique is involved so I'll tell you what usually happens. When the gate drops my reaction time is pretty slow or I end up doing a quick wheely out of the gate. I have to back off for just a second to get the bike back under control but by that time my chances are over. I'm not sure what I do cause guys who are alot slower than me on the track get great starts.

This last weekend I was the fastest guy on the track but had to come from almost dead last to finish first. But the 2nd moto I was not able to do this. I end up getting stuck behind much slower guys for too long. This happened to be a one line track so I had to work extra hard.

I'm 6'3" 200 lbs and my entire body is sitting on the gas cap with my chest and head over the bars. The bike still wheelies out of the gate...more like jumps out of the gate. Someone told me to hold it at half throttle and have the clutch just at the point where it wants to let the bike go. Then let it out so it slips while going thru the gate. But only time I have been able to do that enede up a loop out half way down the straight.

Its hard to practice it because I don't have a gate that I have to react to. I usually start the bike better but its on my own timing that I'm practicing at. ANy ideas?

MXDAD65 · Jun 7, 2004

What gear are you starting in and what kind of bike do you have?
I have a friend who starts in 3rd on a Honda CR125. Another who starts is 2nd on a YZF250.I start in 2nd or 3rd depending on the dirt.I feel slow also btw.My son starts in 2nd on his rm 65.Last to first,you must be pretty fast.Is it possible it is nerves?

SpectraSVT · Jun 7, 2004

I have 03 YZ 250 and I start in 2nd. I'm not fast, I was cherry picking. My buddy was tied for 1st with someone else in my class and this was the last round. I was not in the series so I dropped down a class to stay out of his way. We are same speed and always get stuck racing each other.

I can't get off the gate at all. If its a long straight then I can get midpack by the end of the start but short starts don't leave me much time. Seeing how I have never gotten a good start I don't think its nerves. I was not nervous at all for this race cause I knew I would do well.

billtx · Jun 7, 2004

There are a lot of different techniques for starting. I got fairly decent at starts towards the end of my racing days (1974-1981). It was two things that helped me.
1. Just be smooth out of the gate - half throttle is ok, whatever works for you.
2. At the amatuer races I used to go to, I would watch a good number of moto start's before mine and count how many seconds the gate would drop after the guy turned the board sideways. I was amazed at how consistent they would be. I would just count that many seconds and go. It worked well (although I nailed the gate every now and then!!).

muddy226 · Jun 7, 2004

There seem to be many different techniques for starts. I'm no good at starts, and I asked a friend who holeshot about 1 in 3 of his races, and he says he just gives it max gas and dumps the clutch completely, no feeding in or anything, and then adjusts body position to control the resulting wheelspin. In other words he appears to be using the tyre/dirt as a clutch. It doesn't work for me, and I try to follow the standard expert advice and hold the throttle about two thirds and ready to make power, the clutch just at the point of biting, one finger on the brake, head over number plate, watch for the pin to move, then full gas and release the clutch smoothly but quickly, so that ideally you come out the gate with the front wheel about 6" off the ground and keep it that way til you shut off for the corner. Whatever you do, DO NOT close the throttle, but if you wheely too much feather the clutch until back under control. This I think is the most important thing to remember, the throttle should be wide open and not used for controlling anything much at all out of the gate. If you wheely and chop the throttle you will lose time until the throttle gets open again. Use clutch and body position only at starts, and if starting in 2nd gear like most do be ready to hook 3rd while just feathering the clutch and keeping the throttle open. As I said, this is what I try to do because that is what most experts say, but I usually mess up by slipping the clutch for too long. I think the idea is to have the clutch fully out after about the first five yards. You'll probably get lots of different ideas on this one, if you try them all you'll probably find one that works for you.

SpectraSVT · Jun 7, 2004

Smooth out of the gate is what I can't do...or even know how to do. Dumping the clutch while at full throttle sounds frikking scary and I would be making at trip to the local MX store to purchase a new rear fender. I was actually thinking about this...wheel spin. Do you get better starts with the rear tire spinning or is it supposed to hook up right away? Finding that balance seems like something you have to get a feel for...not something you just go out and do.

Will practicing starts repeatedly for a long period of time crap out my clutch? Is there a practice ritual you guys go thru for practicing this?

High Lord Gomer · Jun 7, 2004

Nothing but practice will help.

I'm not a very good rider, but I get good starts (almost always in the first 3 and frequently in the lead).

I keep both feet on the ground
look 10 feet in front of the gate to catch the movement of the gate more in my peripheral vision
Put my goggles on when the '2' comes out
Put it in gear and let out the clutch to wear it starts grabbing when the 1 comes out
Two fingers on the clutch and my middle finger on the front brake with a slight overgrip on the throttle so I know I can really use full throttle down the start
On the 450, I can usually run 2nd the whole way to the first turn, a 250 2 stroke might require a shift halfway.
My starts are more a matter of holding it on in the first turn rather than getign off the gate very well.

Chili · Jun 7, 2004

My son and his racing buddy practice starts together with me as the "flagger" so to speak to simulate having to react to something. I would say practice practice practice until you find what works for you. And yes your gonna wear out the clutch but hey a couple of holeshots will make you feel better about buying a new set of plates :laugh:

Chili · Jun 7, 2004

High Lord Gomer said:
My starts are more a matter of holding it on in the first turn rather than getign off the gate very well.
[/list]

Doesn't get any truer than that. I watch so many racers get a good jump and give up 10-15 spots going into the first turn by shutting it off too soon.

muddy226 · Jun 8, 2004

Wheelspin - you'll nearly always have wheelspin for the first few yards, if you don't you will almost certainly wheely, or be slipping the clutch too much to get max speed.

markthomps · Jun 8, 2004

Sounds like your technique is mostly okay but your head isn't in it yet. Starts are won in your mind, more than anyplace else. Good reflexes and practice help (especially practice), but you've got yourself psyched out before the gate even drops. As Gomer points out, most of a good start is simply holding it on longer than anybody else and most guys will never do that. Picture yourself holeshotting and expect to be in the lead and you might just find yourself there.

bluerider125 · Jun 9, 2004

have you tried starting in 1st? it sounds like you are doing everything you can, with body position and all. maybe a little wheelspin would be a good thing in your case (wheelying too much)

my 125 will NOT start in 2nd gear, so 1st gear starts are a must. after a while, you will learn to control the clutch so that you don't spin the tire super bad off the concrete, but it sounds like you are on dirt. shifting gears during the start is somewhat slower than not shifting (like Gomer does with the fofiddy) but i'm in 4th before i slam the brakes to make the first turn- your 250 won't need to go to 4th i bet :)

one race, just try starting in first at high RPMs- you'll spin more but at least you will have a rear fender. and besides, you said it yourself that your starts aren't so good so if it doesnt work you won't be out too much LOL.

Rob

slideways11 · Jun 9, 2004

The thing that really helped me get good starts was a Power Start lap timer. It has a set of start sequence lights built into it , it straps to your front fender and then has a sender unit you place in the first turn, so it tells you how long it takes you to get from the gate to the first turn. Practicing with this thing you can alter your technique and you know immediatley if what you did was good or bad. It also helps improve your reaction time because the start sequence changes everytime so you cannot anticipate the green light.

SpectraSVT · Jun 9, 2004

How much and where did you get that?

1st gear would be bad. I usually run out of 2nd quick so 1st gear would be even worse. So far I don't know what to try. I thought there was a step by step thing but guess not. I'll try and get that wheel spinning more just have to forget my 1 loop out doing that.

Do I want my nuts on the gas cap or do I want my butt farther back and have my upper body leaned over more? Seems like the quick wheely throws me back and out of oposition.

High Lord Gomer · Jun 9, 2004

Unless the staring line is sand or slippery mud, I sit all the way up to the gas cap and lean forward as far as I can.

The only time I've felt like I should have been back more was when I spun coming off a dirty, concrete starting pad. If I had been farterh back, I would have then wheelied and had to back off when I hit the traction after the pad, so the correct fix would have been to clean the concrete and stay as far as possible forward. Unless it is very slippery or sandy, I don't think you can get too far forward.

slideways11 · Jun 10, 2004

http://www.powerstart-systems.com/endorsment.htm

Ol'89r · Jun 10, 2004

High Lord Gomer said:
Nothing but practice will help.

[*]look 10 feet in front of the gate to catch the movement of the gate more in my peripheral vision
QUOTE]

IMO, this is the most important thing to remember for getting good starts. You actually have to trick your mind into reacting faster than it normally would.

Most riders seem to look directly down at the gate. When the gate drops, it takes a split second for you mind to register what your eyes have just seen. By that time, most everyone is gone. :ohmy:

By not looking at the gate directly and using your peripheral vision to tell your brain that the gate has moved, your reaction time will be much less. This works with a gate a flag or a starting light. You may get hung up in the gate a couple times learning this technique but once you get the timing figured out you'll be amazed at the difference it will make.

I usually look all the way into the first corner and tell myself, 'that's where I want to be.' As soon as your peripheral vision senses any movement, you pin it.

The rest is just figuring out how to get the best traction for the situation and holding it on longer into the first turn than everybody else. And practice, practice, practice. :cool:

Just my $ .02

Ol'89r

SpectraSVT · Jun 10, 2004

slideways11 said:
http://www.powerstart-systems.com/endorsment.htm

Ouch...$388 is quite a price. Sounds cool but thats too much money for me. :ugg:

theturbojosh · Jun 10, 2004

From the info you have given it sounds as though you have the correct body position but incorrect hip position to solve this get into the position you normally start in and make a consciouss effort to roll your hips back...doing this will eliminate some of the inertia pulling the front end up this is a technique straight out of the gary semics book...........

SpectraSVT · Jun 10, 2004

I'll try that...thx.

elf · Jun 13, 2004

SpectraSVT said:
Its hard to practice it because I don't have a gate that I have to react to. I usually start the bike better but its on my own timing that I'm practicing at. ANy ideas?

You dont need a gate to practice starts. find a flat peice of ground with good traction and practice starting in 2nd gear
All you have to do is go 100 feet or so.You need to get a feel for how your bike works from a dead stop. Keep on trying till you can do 3 or 4 good ones in a row. Also consider having a friend video tape you on the start. so you can see where your body is positioned. You might be forward on the bike at the gate but maybe you unconsciously move back causing the front wheel to come up..

MX Start gate technique?

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