I know that many of you out there are woods riders. I am technically a woods rider, but I'm not any good. Can you all give me tips for using my stock cr in the woods? The little kids on xr100's are faster than me in the woods. These woods I speak of are leaf covered tight trails. The twists and turns seem to be what slow me down the most. Thanks for any help.
Woods riding in general
- Thread starter yzeater
- Start date
sixstring4137785
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- Mar 31, 2000
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Is the problem you or the bike ?
that is the question....:)
that is the question....:)
- Jul 31, 2000
- 2,082
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what kind of problems in turns? sliding out? If so then check the air pressure in your tire, it's probably too hard.
Stay loose on the bike, it's what always works for me in the woods.
Good Luck :)
Stay loose on the bike, it's what always works for me in the woods.
Good Luck :)
HiG4s
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- Mar 7, 2001
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Well to start with you have to realize an XR100 for a kid is a great woods bike. The brakes suck, but you hardly ever need them because of engine braking. It has larger wheels and tires than a mini MX bike so it handles the little stuff great (not good for jumps, but not an issue usually in the woods). It has tons of low end for its size and has a much shorter wheel base than your CR. Stuff that is a sharp turn for you is a sweeping corner for them. When my son switched bikes he was faster on the MX track right away but it was 4 or 5 riding sessions before was as fast in the woods with his YZ85 as he had been with his XR100.
I ride my 125 MX bike in the woods too, I tend to run a gear high and stay out of the power band unless it's an open area. The only real problem is the very rough stuff because of the narrow power band and high first gear. I don't try to climb the steep rutted stuff or go through the very slow stuff I use to on my KTM EXC.
I ride my 125 MX bike in the woods too, I tend to run a gear high and stay out of the power band unless it's an open area. The only real problem is the very rough stuff because of the narrow power band and high first gear. I don't try to climb the steep rutted stuff or go through the very slow stuff I use to on my KTM EXC.
okay, lets not make excuses by looking at the bike. A '00 CR125 will turn with the best of them. The bike isn't the weak link here, its the rider (no offence, as the rider is almost always the weak link, especially when we are talking about such a great new bike).
you say you ride in tight single track, covered with leaves. Ill assume that there are trees close to the track. This can be really difficult, especially if the trees are barely a bar width apart, and if you are losing your confidence through here, then obviously the XR100s are going to be making ground on you. The only real tip here is ‘don’t look at the trees, or if you start to lose confidence, you will go where you look’.
Staying in the ‘attack’ position and using your legs to steer the bike is a good way of getting through slow, numerous turns. Its no good sitting down for the turn just so you can get up again for a second or two to get over a rough section. Using your legs will conserve your energy. Keep your elbows up for good control. But it doesn’t work everywhere, just under rough terrain with tree roots, rocks and so on. In these conditions, standing is a must, as it allows the bike to work under you. Another advantage of this position is the ability to use the rear brake to slide around tight hair pin type corners. Once the rear wheel is locked and swung to the correct direction, don’t dump the clutch, ease it out. Remember the ‘smooth is fast rule’.
You can also sit down for the turns if its wet and slippery. By staying well forward on the bike, you can just use your weight to tip the bike into the turns. Again, this will save energy which is important after 20 or so consecutive turns. Don’t extend your leg out like you normally would, because in tight single track, there is usually a tree there and you run the risk of nasty injury. This is why its important to sit well forward on the bike, as you don’t have the leg there to add extra weight to the front wheel.
Can you be a bit more specific about your problem? Its more than likely just a confidence thing, so practice makes perfect, but just like all aspects of bike riding, you need quality practice using the correct technique. Practicing without technique really is a waste of effort, but only if you strive to become better. Set up some cones or rocks in a line and practice the above method by weaving in and out of the cones. This way you don’t have to worry about hitting tress, and just concentrate on technique. Try sitting down and standing up, and see which one you prefer. Don’t forget about learning how to brake slide around turns, as this is quite a good skill to learn, if only to develop better bike control.
you say you ride in tight single track, covered with leaves. Ill assume that there are trees close to the track. This can be really difficult, especially if the trees are barely a bar width apart, and if you are losing your confidence through here, then obviously the XR100s are going to be making ground on you. The only real tip here is ‘don’t look at the trees, or if you start to lose confidence, you will go where you look’.
Staying in the ‘attack’ position and using your legs to steer the bike is a good way of getting through slow, numerous turns. Its no good sitting down for the turn just so you can get up again for a second or two to get over a rough section. Using your legs will conserve your energy. Keep your elbows up for good control. But it doesn’t work everywhere, just under rough terrain with tree roots, rocks and so on. In these conditions, standing is a must, as it allows the bike to work under you. Another advantage of this position is the ability to use the rear brake to slide around tight hair pin type corners. Once the rear wheel is locked and swung to the correct direction, don’t dump the clutch, ease it out. Remember the ‘smooth is fast rule’.
You can also sit down for the turns if its wet and slippery. By staying well forward on the bike, you can just use your weight to tip the bike into the turns. Again, this will save energy which is important after 20 or so consecutive turns. Don’t extend your leg out like you normally would, because in tight single track, there is usually a tree there and you run the risk of nasty injury. This is why its important to sit well forward on the bike, as you don’t have the leg there to add extra weight to the front wheel.
Can you be a bit more specific about your problem? Its more than likely just a confidence thing, so practice makes perfect, but just like all aspects of bike riding, you need quality practice using the correct technique. Practicing without technique really is a waste of effort, but only if you strive to become better. Set up some cones or rocks in a line and practice the above method by weaving in and out of the cones. This way you don’t have to worry about hitting tress, and just concentrate on technique. Try sitting down and standing up, and see which one you prefer. Don’t forget about learning how to brake slide around turns, as this is quite a good skill to learn, if only to develop better bike control.
Boozer,
Read your posting where you mentioned practicing good technique. Since I am a new rider that really made sense. The best "general" advice I've received is look where you want to go (don't oversteer the bike) and keep your speed up climbing hills. I'm really excited about riding off-road, but am much more challenged (which is good) than street riding. Thanks for the tips!
Read your posting where you mentioned practicing good technique. Since I am a new rider that really made sense. The best "general" advice I've received is look where you want to go (don't oversteer the bike) and keep your speed up climbing hills. I'm really excited about riding off-road, but am much more challenged (which is good) than street riding. Thanks for the tips!
I have been ridding in the woods since age 5. I do race some harescrambles and enduros from time to time and these are some things to keep in mind. First a couple things about the bike that you will want to consider if you ride for any length of time in the woods:
Cut your bars down to between 29.5 and 31 inches (tight eastern woods).
Set your suspension up on the softer side.
Get bark busters. Good ones. I like to have metal in them. The all plastic ones make me feel like I am bouncing off trees instead of ricochet.
As money permits you may want a steering dampner down the road.
I run about 12 to 14 PSI in my tires. I run fast and hard and have never had trouble with flats or bent wheels. Knock on wood.
As for ridding techniques. Just as the other posts say. Never look at something you don't want to hit (Heat seeking vision syndrome). Only look where you want to go. Keep your eyes glancing 20 feet to 5 feet in front of you. Stay loose. Usually stay one gear higher than what you might think. This will keep you smooth and keep your traction up. It will also remind you to go a little faster when you can to keep the gear. Keep your front end light through puddles and never gas hard right after going through one. Boozer already covered the cornering, steering with your knees, and keeping your elbows up. Also pay attention to when it makes the most since to stand up or sit down. There is no substitute for saddle time. Find a woods section that you can run a loop on and practice it until you are confident and fast through it. The rest is just a matter of finding other fast guys at the trails and have them ride with you so you can see what they do and they can give you pointers on what you are doing wrong. Happy trails.
Hainsey
Cut your bars down to between 29.5 and 31 inches (tight eastern woods).
Set your suspension up on the softer side.
Get bark busters. Good ones. I like to have metal in them. The all plastic ones make me feel like I am bouncing off trees instead of ricochet.
As money permits you may want a steering dampner down the road.
I run about 12 to 14 PSI in my tires. I run fast and hard and have never had trouble with flats or bent wheels. Knock on wood.
As for ridding techniques. Just as the other posts say. Never look at something you don't want to hit (Heat seeking vision syndrome). Only look where you want to go. Keep your eyes glancing 20 feet to 5 feet in front of you. Stay loose. Usually stay one gear higher than what you might think. This will keep you smooth and keep your traction up. It will also remind you to go a little faster when you can to keep the gear. Keep your front end light through puddles and never gas hard right after going through one. Boozer already covered the cornering, steering with your knees, and keeping your elbows up. Also pay attention to when it makes the most since to stand up or sit down. There is no substitute for saddle time. Find a woods section that you can run a loop on and practice it until you are confident and fast through it. The rest is just a matter of finding other fast guys at the trails and have them ride with you so you can see what they do and they can give you pointers on what you are doing wrong. Happy trails.
Hainsey
bbbom
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- Aug 13, 1999
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Excellent advice Hainsey. I know my riding has improved significantly since I started riding with my honey. My son's riding also improved when he started following him.
It really helps to ride with a good rider and try to do what they do then to have them follow you and critique your riding.
Karl's a very smooth fast woods rider. It's always fun to watch the younger guys come out to ride and challenge him. They usually leave after the ride a little humbled. Wonder what will happen if I ever get fast enough to keep up with him! :scream: Probably won't get anyone to come back for a second ride.
It really helps to ride with a good rider and try to do what they do then to have them follow you and critique your riding.
Karl's a very smooth fast woods rider. It's always fun to watch the younger guys come out to ride and challenge him. They usually leave after the ride a little humbled. Wonder what will happen if I ever get fast enough to keep up with him! :scream: Probably won't get anyone to come back for a second ride.
Did my 2nd off-road ride @ Hollister on Saturday. My first time @ Hollister (much nicer than Metcalf for a newbie). Although it was more crowded than I was comfortable with, I had some really good rides on the easier courses. Both times that I crashed were probably due to over-reacting and inexperience. Once was a slide out in the mud and the other, thru soft dirt that threw the bike in a ditch (I escaped the ditch). I'm not sure what happened with the soft dirt, cause I was just riding along and BOOM, down we went. Another rider stopped and rode the bike out of the ditch for me -- Thank you if you are out there -- and let me know that I really should have the proper riding gear. I definitely need a off-road helment and some riding pants. My face was covered w/dirt & my legs are bruised up. Very minor, but why suffer!!
Hainesy4 - Kept your advice in mind about staying loose and it really does help.
All-in-all, I had a great day and can't wait to go back!!
Hainesy4 - Kept your advice in mind about staying loose and it really does help.
All-in-all, I had a great day and can't wait to go back!!
Don't look at the trees, you will hit them.
I have started using the clutch less, leaving the throttle on even when applying the back brake. (Freddettes Style) Brake sliding around every corner is not the fastest way through the woods. As Terry Cuningham said,"You win races by going fast in the corner, everyone can go fast in the straightaways."
Other than that its practice, practice,practice.
I have started using the clutch less, leaving the throttle on even when applying the back brake. (Freddettes Style) Brake sliding around every corner is not the fastest way through the woods. As Terry Cuningham said,"You win races by going fast in the corner, everyone can go fast in the straightaways."
Other than that its practice, practice,practice.
ride_red_15
Uhhh...
- Oct 14, 2001
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i just grab the throttle and keep shifting, then when i get to something i.e. turn, i hit the back break and downshift and slide into the corner, that way you can maintain momentum
CR Swade
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- Jan 18, 2001
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You have a ton of great advice in here. The ones that really stand out are loose, reactive positioning in a good attack mode on fast sections and when it gets gnarly, I get small. I ride maybe 2 inches off of the seat in a kinda-crouched position, or completely seated. When you stay forward on the bike (really forward) in this "small" position while in the tight twisties you can really thread the bike around.
At creek crossings, unless you know the crossing-wait and watch a few in practice to witness the bad spots. That way during the race, you can approach with a confident manner. Creek crossings, hills and logs will reward the aggressive technique and conversely a timid, hunt-and-peck approach will usually get you on the ground.
Learn to flow. The clutch and good throttle control are your friend for controlling wheelspin and maintaining drive. I too drag the heck out of my rear brake. Many times I'm dragging it as I accelerate, particularly on choppy or rooty sections. It acts like a flywheel weight. For learning how to flow, learning to drag your brake is a great tip-as stated by justql and Fredette.
Flowing also means maintaining momentum in the turns. Use your knees to grip the frame/tank to flew the tires and let it stick while maintaining drive. Brake sliding has its place, just don't use that in place of good turning technique. Brake sliding all of the turns wears you out physically as you never get a true momentum built up since you are always stopping and going. The blazin' fast guys never even break pace-it's truly amazing to watch them flow around gnarly loops
Just spend time on the bike, learn to ride a gear higher and flow (positioning, knees, brakes).
Lastly, if you are still running a stock MX suspension all of this about a gozillion times harder to do in a long race. Woods set-up will help immensely.
:)
At creek crossings, unless you know the crossing-wait and watch a few in practice to witness the bad spots. That way during the race, you can approach with a confident manner. Creek crossings, hills and logs will reward the aggressive technique and conversely a timid, hunt-and-peck approach will usually get you on the ground.
Learn to flow. The clutch and good throttle control are your friend for controlling wheelspin and maintaining drive. I too drag the heck out of my rear brake. Many times I'm dragging it as I accelerate, particularly on choppy or rooty sections. It acts like a flywheel weight. For learning how to flow, learning to drag your brake is a great tip-as stated by justql and Fredette.
Flowing also means maintaining momentum in the turns. Use your knees to grip the frame/tank to flew the tires and let it stick while maintaining drive. Brake sliding has its place, just don't use that in place of good turning technique. Brake sliding all of the turns wears you out physically as you never get a true momentum built up since you are always stopping and going. The blazin' fast guys never even break pace-it's truly amazing to watch them flow around gnarly loops
Just spend time on the bike, learn to ride a gear higher and flow (positioning, knees, brakes).
Lastly, if you are still running a stock MX suspension all of this about a gozillion times harder to do in a long race. Woods set-up will help immensely.
:)
cr125_king
Member
- Apr 2, 2001
- 343
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Heres what i do. At my local riding spot i built a 6km harescramble like track. In the one section i made it so tight, that almost everyone has trouble. If you practice on thougher stuff, come race time, it's easy(better). I also find standing on the downhill sections helps alot too. I try to stand as much as i can.Also practice with someone better than you, and learn from them. Watch what they do, and try and see if you can keep up.My first race(harescramble) that i ever did, i hit so manyy trees, it was horrible. I sucked in the tight sections, and it was hell. Now a year later(and 5 races), i'm way better and confident in the tight stuff, and cornering.:)
cr125_king
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- Apr 2, 2001
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Muddy conditions: The most important thing to me is make sure you got good tires. The right tire makes a huge difference. If you got a bad front tire on, you'll go down lots. The main thing is try to maintain traction. Try not to get wheelspin, because thats when you get out of control.other than that practice, practice, practice.:)
Montana300
Member
- May 4, 2000
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The best advice I can give is that you to keep your head up. At times when my riding is not "flowing" I force myself to look up and it usually helps. If you are looking just in front of your fender you are reacting to obstacles rather than setting up for them before the front end slides or back kicks etc.
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