Another newbie KDX question- KIPS port

Bryan Kimsey

Member
Sep 10, 2001
53
0
What's the purpose of the KIPS cover on the left side? I removed it and there's this black hole. If I rev the engine a little, exhaust comes out. If I rev it a little more, I can see flame. Emergency cigarette lighter? :D Was just checking to see if the KIPS was working okay....

Is there any cleaning/maint I can do to the port w/out disassembling it?

And finally, is the Kawie shop manual the recommended one? I've had dirt bikes for 25 years and am pretty mechanically inclined.

Thanks mucho! Time to go ridin'....
 

David Trustrum

~SPONSOR~
Jan 25, 2001
1,396
0
The LHS works in conjunction with the powervalves. The main function of the powervalves is to expose more exhaust port at higher revs & close off port at lower revs preventing loss of unburnt fuel when the port would otherwise be open too long & fuel/air mix would escape.

When the engine is in a favourable rev range, the pipe is providing useful suction & supercharging wave effects, but out of this range these same waves are detrimental.

The chamber is opened to disrupt the effect of the returning waves when they aren’t favourable (ie at lower revs).


There is no emergency that requires a cigarette.


The valves are a wonder of engineering. Sadly if you don’t take them apart to clean them they will gunk up, seize & strip the gears on the top.
 

canyncarvr

~SPONSOR~
Oct 14, 1999
4,005
0
The cover on the left (the one that sez KIPS) covers the 'Hemholtz Resonator'.

Interesting name for an emergency butt lighter, 'eh?

In front of that is a slotted cover that will expose the end of the rod that drives the assembly. Remove that cover and you can rotate the assembly manually to see (feel) how sticky or stuck it is. When rotated fully open and then let go, it should snap back into place...not oozily-sludge-move sorta.

With the pipe off, look inside the exhaust port to see that the main valve and the drums (sub-ports) to either side move as they should. There is a decent explanation of what moves when in the Kawi manual..which is a good deal to get.

Basically, at rest, the main port is 'down' and the sub-ports are 'closed' (which means OPEN to the resonator. Actuate the KIPS ..preferably NOT at this point by starting the bike and looking up the exhaust port ;) ..using the nut under the LH cover to see stuff move.

If something don't move, it's broke! The actuator rods for one of the sub-ports may be stripped. You can see this if it's happened without taking it all apart.

BUT..proper cleaning DOES require disassembly. I've heard tales of bikers spraying oven cleaner into the valve with it still on the bike!!..cuz they heard that oven cleaner was the thing to use.

OK...but with the KIPS OUT of the bike!

Take note!!..When taking the kips shaft off the assembly on the RH side of the bike..SUPPORT THE ACTUATING SHAFT!! There is a flat on the shaft for this purpose. AND...it's a LH thread nut!!

DON'T support it, and it WILL break later at the most inopportune time, causing maybe megadamage in the process. Clutches and reduction gears don't take kindly to bits of metal floating around where they shun't be!
 

JimVowell

Member
Jul 19, 2001
33
0
CANYNCARVR, Sounds like you know your stuff. I just did my top end and I think I have a Power valve problem. I have not worked on Power valve bikes but have done many topend prior to 1985. The problem is no TOp end power at all. I have the FMF pipe mod and until I changed the TOP end and tried to clean the KIPS It railed from bottom to top. Now only bottom end and then its dead. Here the problem. When I went to put the Acuator arm back on the rigt side There was a dot on the atuator arm and a spec of paint on the Gear going into the Cylinder (right side). Unfortunately during my cleaning I wipe the paint off of the gear. Is there any way to know what the correct position is without the paint mark. Also when the valves are full open or closed the mechanism seems to stick. Any help would be awesome. I want to get some good advise before I tear this thing down again...Thanks....
 

motox

Member
May 21, 2001
90
0
JimVowell, send me an email and I'll send you the picture, in detail, on how the kips valves line up. I did my 1992 kdx about 3 months ago. You'll have to print out 2 or 3 sheets and then just follow directions and look at the pictures. My KDX screams now and has bottom end to spare.
kevinpaula@iol-12.net
 

Canadian Dave

Super Power AssClown
Apr 28, 1999
1,202
0
Jim its normal to feel some slight sticking as the KIPS valves start to open. There's an indenture ball on one side that supplies some resistance to motion as the valves just open.

Do you have a Kawasaki shop manual? The manual does a good job of explaining how the KIPS valve system goes together and how to insure its properly timed. That said there is one mistake in the manual that if followed will result in the left and right sub port valves being reversed. Check out the " Manual Correction " article on the JustKDX web site. If you are concerned that yours isn't properly timed pull the pipe and look up into the exhaust port. You should find that the main exhaust valve is in the fully down position and both the left and right sub port valves are closed.

It sounds to me like you have one of two problems, either the valves are improperly timed or the main KIPS shaft is damaged and the system is not operating properly. You're in luck this months JustKDX tech tip deals with proper disassembly of the KIPS system/shaft. Go to the JustKDX web page, click on tech tips then " This Months Tech Tip".

David
 
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JimVowell

Member
Jul 19, 2001
33
0
Dave, thanks very much for the info....I love this bike, but after my first rebuild I was a little bummed and really needed to bounce this off of someone. I will check on the info at JustKDX tech tips... Thanks again.....
 

JimVowell

Member
Jul 19, 2001
33
0
Dave, I removed the pipe and heres the deal. The Main Exhaust port opening does look like the book (closed valve ie exhaust port reduced about 3/8 of an inch) and the sub valves were closed, BUT ... When I did the topend and I was cleaning the cylinder one of the spacers that sits on top of the sub valves fell out. I pulled up on the sub valve to reseat it form the top of the cylinder. I remember turning it to get it to seat, thing is now when I look at the sub valve ports in the closed position (from the ehaust opening pipe removed) one valve is convexed and one is concaved, meaning the round part is sticking out covering the port on one side and on the other the side the sub valve is the opposite side of the valve or looks like a crater but covering the port. Are they supposed to look the same and is it bowed out or bowed in. Sounds like my sub valves are not aligned properly (timed ?) ...I wish I had another bike to look at. Let me know what you think. Thanks...
 

sj

Member
Dec 19, 1999
23
0
Hey CanynCarver
Do you mean support the shaft when you remove the nut or what.
I did my top end & P/V late summer & was all proud of myself. the bike runs great (much improved midrange) & now you say it's gonna explode or something. Whats up with that?
 

sj

Member
Dec 19, 1999
23
0
Sorry Guys
Just answered my own Question on the shop tips page which BTW is great.
Without this info I never would have known there was a misprint in my shop manual and right there on the P/Valve page at that.
I probably did NOT support the shaft when I removed the nut but I'm not sure.Would you recomend replacing the shaft just to be sure?
Can you tell by looking if its damaged?
And finally, can you get at this critter from the clutch cover?

Thanks a heap
 

hillclimberr

Member
Nov 7, 2001
31
0
Would putting a spacer on the kips valve give more bottom end? Also I was wondering if adding another gasket between the cylinder and the head cover or base would decrease my compression therefore increasing topend. My bike is a 92 kdx 200.

Thane Reukauf
 

David Trustrum

~SPONSOR~
Jan 25, 2001
1,396
0
The Chamber that the powervalve opens is a ‘disrupter’ to reduce the effects of the returning wave from the pipe when it’s effects are unwanted. It closes when the wave is in sync & it'’ effects are wanted. Thus volume it not critical as such like a intake boost bottle (which is another story I won’t bore you with).

Typically there is a max compression ratio for top end, assuming consistent use of decent fuel, ignition & head shape (MSV etc). On a stock engine that is set up to account for manufacturing tolerances & the assumption the owner will run on the cheapest gas he can find. Lowering the compression ratio will further reduce the efficiency of the engine.
 

jo8243

Member
Aug 11, 2001
51
0
Anyonee know why the links to pages on the just kdx site earlier in this thread do not work? 404 errors......
.
If you go to the justkdx site main page several of the links are broken there well..
 

Canadian Dave

Super Power AssClown
Apr 28, 1999
1,202
0
jo8243 you must be looking at the old address. Click the link here at the btm of this post to see the page at its new address. If you do s search for the page the original address still comes up in most cases. I've been working at updating all the search engines with our new address but it'll take some time.

JV - "
Sounds like my sub valves are not aligned properly (timed ?)
Sounds that way to me too. Invest in a cylinder head gasket and double check the timing/alignment. Do you have a shop manual? If so remember that some manuals have a mistake and wrongly identify the L vs R subport valve. You can find the correction on the JustKDX web site. If you don't have a manual let me know and I'll attempt to walk you through the proper timing sequence.

David
 
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JimVowell

Member
Jul 19, 2001
33
0
Big Dave, I have ordered the gasket kit and will re-adjust the left sub valve. After looking closely and referring to the service manual, my left sub valve is 180 degrees out (bacwards). When I was replacing it I hosed it. The valve is actually closed with resonator opened at full throttle and semi closed at idle. Thanks again for your help. I look forward to ripping ths weekend ...
 

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