I have a 2001 KX 250. I ride in PA which is mostly between 1000 and 2000 feet above sea level. Lately I have been running Maxima Castor 927 at 32:1 with 94 octane pump gas and a B7ES plug. I changed the jetting to improve the throttle response and to clean up the black spooge coming out the silencer. I read that spooge is usually caused by a rich pilot. I went two sizes leaner on the pilot (52-48), one notch leaner on the needle (2-1), and one size leaner on the main(160-158). I have no problem with how the bike runs now, but no matter how I adjust the pilot/air screw, I still get the black spooge, and I am hesitant to go three sizes leaner on the pilot. I am thinking that since most of the time I run the throttle in the needle stage that I will try a leaner needle setting. Since I am at the leanest clip position I will need to get a leaner jet needle (NAFF- NAFE). Is there overlap between jet needles, and if so where? ie:what clip position on a NAFE needle is one step leaner than #1 on a NAFF. Do you think doing this will clear up the spooge?
black spooge / jet needle overlap
- Thread starter BKC
- Start date
I would look at switching to the Maxima M. It is a cleaner burning oil than the 927. It doesn't smell as good tho. You can even lighten up on the mix ratio slightly, like to 40:1 with the 927 and be quite alright. But changing to the SuperM is probably your best bet.
yz250roost
~SPONSOR~
- Oct 16, 2000
- 534
- 0
let's count how many people that read this have spooge.......I do so that's two now.
Guys... maybe try a search in several of the forums here on "spooge". Honestly, jetting and twisting the throttle is key... if you ride a MX bike like a trail bike (not saying anyone does), you'll get spooge. If the jetting is way out, same thing/adds to it. The oil ratio has little to do with it. The oil itself has little to do with it (Rich will probably nail me for that one)... pick a good synthetic oil (I always liked Yamalube R2), get your bike jetted correctly... then you only have one thing to blame if you still get spooged...
To answer your question regarding overlap... if you are on clip position1, the 'equivalant' is position 3 on the next step leaner needle. It really isn't though.... needle root diameter (which is what you are changing) effects the transition from pilot circuit to needle. An overly small (rich) root diameter will act like an overly rich pilot. Lowering the needle masks the problem, in that 1/4 to3/4 will now be too lean if it was right before. Changing the needle taper has an effect over the entire range of the needle, but not as much as lowering the clip. So... I would say use the next leaner needle in the -3 or -2 position and try. 48 should be good for the pilot, so fiddle with the airscrew and let us know how it goes. P.S. I am totally with Okiewan on the oil issue...
I too am with Okie on this one.
I do however feel that different oils burn differntly.
One thing is for sure, advise to change ratio when chasing a spooge problem is way off base. Going to less oil will increase your spooge. Just trust that. (without a circuit change)
I also believe that the fuel one uses has alot to do with spooge. Even if you are jetted spot-on, you can still get spooge from alot of pump swill.
I use TurboBlue 110, and it is a junk race fuel IMHO which spooges a bit no matter what. Avgas will spooge like that too.
I would try what sk suggests. And read what Okie suggests.
I do however feel that different oils burn differntly.
One thing is for sure, advise to change ratio when chasing a spooge problem is way off base. Going to less oil will increase your spooge. Just trust that. (without a circuit change)
I also believe that the fuel one uses has alot to do with spooge. Even if you are jetted spot-on, you can still get spooge from alot of pump swill.
I use TurboBlue 110, and it is a junk race fuel IMHO which spooges a bit no matter what. Avgas will spooge like that too.
I would try what sk suggests. And read what Okie suggests.
May not totally fix the problem, but most of the spooge is unburnt oil. Both Products are Maxima products, just different mixes and blends. I am interested how you guys think that spooge is mostly caused by oil. I ride a 426 now and it was jetted rich and I never got any spooge. The YZ 250 I rode before was rich when I first got it and I never got the dreaded spooge. Jetting will help but I have not found that you can solve the spooge by jetting alone. There is also something not quite right when you have to run a plug that removes less heat from the cylinder to compensate. Give me some good papers to read that says fuel is the greatest cause of spooge and I will retract any statement about it being partly an unburnt oil problem.
Maybe I'm wrong but isn't a 426 a 4-stroke. :confused: If so, you had better not have any spooge or you'd have major engine problems.
I also don't think the oil brand nor gas type makes much difference. The biggest thing is proper jetting for your riding style.
I disagree with oil being the problem. I think Okie and the guys are right, it is proper jetting for your riding style. I have an 02 CR250 which had spooge leaking out the exhaust and the bike ran very sluggish. I ran 94 pump gas at 40:1 with stock jetting. After some guidence by some of you guys here, I switched to C-12 race gas mixed back at 32:1 (recommended by owners manual) and rejetted the bike according to my slow riding style. NO MORE SPOOGE and the bike runs clean and snappy.
So if it was the oil, when I would have went to a richer premix I would have gotten more spooge not less. It is all in the jetting. Check out the links by canadian dave on how to view rich or lean. ;)
So if it was the oil, when I would have went to a richer premix I would have gotten more spooge not less. It is all in the jetting. Check out the links by canadian dave on how to view rich or lean. ;)
Vic, more oil will lean you out. Don't believe it?
- May 5, 2000
- 4,008
- 0
I know, but you can jet to compensate (as you know). I'm just saying that if you run the engine in a range where it is inefficient, much of what is going in is going to come out, unburned. If there's less oil going in, less is going to come out (assuming you jet leaner to compensate).
FWIW, I don't mind a little spooge and would rather have the high rpm protection that I believe more oil provides.
Now we are talking! :)
The jetting work must take place too was my point. So many chase spooge with ratio.
CR-For-Ever
Member
- Feb 25, 2002
- 166
- 0
Hmm, is it just me but I believe all 2 stroke no matter how they are jetted are gonna have a bit of spooge?
Anyway I'v found the best way to keep down on spooge is to run the bike how it is suppose to be ran keep on the throttle and then normally I dont have any spooge, maybie you are not riding it hard enough?...Never know
Good luck with it
Peace.
Anyway I'v found the best way to keep down on spooge is to run the bike how it is suppose to be ran keep on the throttle and then normally I dont have any spooge, maybie you are not riding it hard enough?...Never know
Good luck with it
Peace.
My bike spooged a lot until I started using amoco 93 and amsoil or mx2t. Other fuels and oils I tried were suzuki cci, golden spectro, sunoco 94, and mobil 93.
I'm not claiming to know why this combo works for me, because I don't know why.
I can tell you I mix it now at 32:1 and jet it richer than others with the same bike. All I get now is a little black damp spot around the silencer hole. I don't think I could get it to spooge if I tried <---- well maybe I could if I really tried. I don't think I ride very hard (woods, no mx tracks) although I am constantly aware of how often I lug it and try to clean/rev it out often.
My point is that in my case, the fuel and oil was the key to a fine running machine with no more spooge. Just my experience.
Joe Chief
I'm not claiming to know why this combo works for me, because I don't know why.
I can tell you I mix it now at 32:1 and jet it richer than others with the same bike. All I get now is a little black damp spot around the silencer hole. I don't think I could get it to spooge if I tried <---- well maybe I could if I really tried. I don't think I ride very hard (woods, no mx tracks) although I am constantly aware of how often I lug it and try to clean/rev it out often.
My point is that in my case, the fuel and oil was the key to a fine running machine with no more spooge. Just my experience.
Joe Chief
dont quote me on this but i think it has to do mostly with octane ratin. higher the octane the hotter it burns. lower octane fuels dont produce enough heat to burn all oil. like i say this is just my opinion plase post if i am wrong. my experience has been race gas and yamalube 2-r no spooge, 93 octane and synthetic oil lots of spooge
Not the case at all.
The higher the octane rating, the higher the flash point. 87 octane will burn more efficiently than 91, 93, or 94 octane. The down side to using lower octane is that there is more "knock".
I always use 32:1 (91 octane/MX2T) on stock jetting on both bikes. I get some spooge when ride in the tight trails. When I'm on long flats/dry lake bed for most of the ride, the bike doesn't really spooge. I just ride to have fun so don't see the need to jet. Good luck.
I always use 32:1 (91 octane/MX2T) on stock jetting on both bikes. I get some spooge when ride in the tight trails. When I'm on long flats/dry lake bed for most of the ride, the bike doesn't really spooge. I just ride to have fun so don't see the need to jet. Good luck.
Octane has nothing to do with flash points or evap rates, but FYI, in most cases with regard to race gasses the final boiling point is LOWER as octane rating increases.
Jet for throttle response, not for spooge elimination. When you can twist to get a result, it is more fun than getting a bog! :think:
Rich, I look forward to hearing your response as well. I have never heard of jetting for riding style...??? My riding style is... 'if I twist, I want the bike to respond instantly'. Are there riders who have a ..."I prefer a bog and a whole lot of hesitation when I TRY to gas it" ...riding style??? And does that "riding style" include the pleasure of changing fouled plugs every hour??? I really was under the impression jetting is either dialed in, or it's not?? Not trying to bust any chops here but... If some of you fellow riders had your jetting circuits dialed in...you would be afraid of your bikes response!
.02 for what it's worth.
.02 for what it's worth.
