Flywheel weights
- Thread starter skipro3
- Start date
Good question-This question has probably been answered a million times but since I'm new too a solid answer from people who do it would be welcomed.I've read that the flywheel weight creates more mass for the engine to turn.This in turn slows down wheel spin.Just guessing here but slowing the rear wheelspin would come in handy to give mor traction in tight situations or mud,but this is my best guess
canyncarvr
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- Oct 14, 1999
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The effects of an increase in mass of an assembly that's spinning is pretty straightforward. It's harder to start it spinning, it's also harder to stop it spinning.
Hook the kdx up to an old john deere single cylinder tractor (with a flywheel the size of texas) and see what kind of throttle response you have! Not too good. But..try stopping the thing once it is moving. Good luck!
What I like best about my steahly FWW is the kdx KEEPS running much better on downhills. Without it, a bit too much brake with not quite enough clutch...you're dead.
As far as the sometimes reported 'It makes your bike rev slower.' That is hardly noticeable...if at all!
It's also a common comment that 'kdxs don't need additional weight. The kdx flywheel is heavy to start with.'
I've run with it and without it. I choose to run with it.
You can find them on the web.
Click HERE to read about 'em.
Great people! Chuck Steahly is a great guy!
Hook the kdx up to an old john deere single cylinder tractor (with a flywheel the size of texas) and see what kind of throttle response you have! Not too good. But..try stopping the thing once it is moving. Good luck!
What I like best about my steahly FWW is the kdx KEEPS running much better on downhills. Without it, a bit too much brake with not quite enough clutch...you're dead.
As far as the sometimes reported 'It makes your bike rev slower.' That is hardly noticeable...if at all!
It's also a common comment that 'kdxs don't need additional weight. The kdx flywheel is heavy to start with.'
I've run with it and without it. I choose to run with it.
You can find them on the web.
Click HERE to read about 'em.
Great people! Chuck Steahly is a great guy!
canyncarvr -
Steahly used to offer a 12 oz. KDX flywheel, but now all I can get (new) is a 10 oz. Would 12 oz. be better, or worse? I assume that you can have "too much of a good thing"...but I'm doing a lot of 1st & 2nd gear hill climbing & brush busting, and my '01 200 isn't nearly as "stall-proof" as my brother's TTR250. So...I think I know that "better or worse" depends upon the situation/rider, but I'm interested in your perspective! Would 12 oz. be too much in your situation?
Jeff
Steahly used to offer a 12 oz. KDX flywheel, but now all I can get (new) is a 10 oz. Would 12 oz. be better, or worse? I assume that you can have "too much of a good thing"...but I'm doing a lot of 1st & 2nd gear hill climbing & brush busting, and my '01 200 isn't nearly as "stall-proof" as my brother's TTR250. So...I think I know that "better or worse" depends upon the situation/rider, but I'm interested in your perspective! Would 12 oz. be too much in your situation?
Jeff
canyncarvr
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- Oct 14, 1999
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I don't have a reasonable answer as I haven't tried both of them.
There will be a point at which added weight will so negatively effect engine ramp-up speed it would not be beneficial. The 10oz. doesn't have that problem. But, again, it is of benefit in downhill situations.
Another situation in which more would not be better...trying to manuever over an obstacle (root or rock) on an uphill once you're already stuck. Yeah, if you were going a decent (correct?) speed in the first place, you wouldn't be stuck, but let's say you are. A controlled pop-up of the front end can certainly help the front wheel in such a situation, and sometimes the rear wheel, too. Too much weight would lead to less of a controlled lift on the front end. This is a situation the 10oz. is a benefit over no additional weight. You have to be kinda careful with it to not just flip the bike..so I don't see that additional weight would be a plus.
So, while I don't have any experience with the 12oz., it does seem that in situations where 'more' could be too much, the 10oz. is on the edge.
Just a guess, but I would imagine steahly doesn't make the 12oz. for the kdx for a reason. They actually do test the things....they don't just strap on some oz.
Call chuck steahly and ask him!
There will be a point at which added weight will so negatively effect engine ramp-up speed it would not be beneficial. The 10oz. doesn't have that problem. But, again, it is of benefit in downhill situations.
Another situation in which more would not be better...trying to manuever over an obstacle (root or rock) on an uphill once you're already stuck. Yeah, if you were going a decent (correct?) speed in the first place, you wouldn't be stuck, but let's say you are. A controlled pop-up of the front end can certainly help the front wheel in such a situation, and sometimes the rear wheel, too. Too much weight would lead to less of a controlled lift on the front end. This is a situation the 10oz. is a benefit over no additional weight. You have to be kinda careful with it to not just flip the bike..so I don't see that additional weight would be a plus.
So, while I don't have any experience with the 12oz., it does seem that in situations where 'more' could be too much, the 10oz. is on the edge.
Just a guess, but I would imagine steahly doesn't make the 12oz. for the kdx for a reason. They actually do test the things....they don't just strap on some oz.
Call chuck steahly and ask him!
Ok, what about the opposite. I would like less flywheel and the part that slides on the shaft and connects to the flywheel is the same for some kx and kdx. But what about the magneto. I guess you would have to use the kx one. Does it fit on a kdx? How much more would it allow the bike to rev?
canyncarvr,
Thanks for your comments. Sorry it has taken me so long to reply! I wanted to have something of substance to report - and I just talked to Chuck (Steahly) again yesterday. While a few guys actually did like the 12 oz., apparently the majority preferred 10 oz., so that is what is offered. Chuck said that when you get too much weight, you can't get into the "horsepower" part of the powerband - especially in power-robbing sand or steep hills (your comment on "ramp-up speed" applies here). "Too much" is something like 15 oz.(for a 200/220), depending upon modifications & jetting & riding style. Since the original post, I've tried a 10 oz. and love it! Given my hankering to experiment, I may try more...
as an aside, one of Chuck's suggestions for "more" was to have a local machine shop utilize the Steahly design w/more weight. He was also willing to tell me about the metal they use, etc. How's that for a guy who wants to serve his customers and the industry, without being stuck on "proprietary information". Way to go, Chuck!
:thumb:
Thanks for your comments. Sorry it has taken me so long to reply! I wanted to have something of substance to report - and I just talked to Chuck (Steahly) again yesterday. While a few guys actually did like the 12 oz., apparently the majority preferred 10 oz., so that is what is offered. Chuck said that when you get too much weight, you can't get into the "horsepower" part of the powerband - especially in power-robbing sand or steep hills (your comment on "ramp-up speed" applies here). "Too much" is something like 15 oz.(for a 200/220), depending upon modifications & jetting & riding style. Since the original post, I've tried a 10 oz. and love it! Given my hankering to experiment, I may try more...
as an aside, one of Chuck's suggestions for "more" was to have a local machine shop utilize the Steahly design w/more weight. He was also willing to tell me about the metal they use, etc. How's that for a guy who wants to serve his customers and the industry, without being stuck on "proprietary information". Way to go, Chuck!
:thumb:
canyncarvr
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- Oct 14, 1999
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An aside on the FFW install/uninstall.
I had much better luck with using a couple of shouldered bolts on the install tool that I cut to the correct length. The bolts with the 'kit' were threaded all the way which made them: 1. Weak due to metal removal, and 2. The threads would damage the tool.
With a shouldered bolt, you can tighten the bolts to the FFW against the shoulder, and that makes for a much more secure tool.
But, I use an air tool.
Also, most impact wrenches (well, ones I've seen) have quite a relieved drive. It doesn't get square for quite a bit of depth. There isn't a lot of space between the tool and the flywheel, but if you use the non-square part of the impact tool in the install tool, you'll bugger it up.
I use an extension on the impact tool. The extension 'relief' is to a much less depth.
Yep! Mr. Steahly is good people.
I had much better luck with using a couple of shouldered bolts on the install tool that I cut to the correct length. The bolts with the 'kit' were threaded all the way which made them: 1. Weak due to metal removal, and 2. The threads would damage the tool.
With a shouldered bolt, you can tighten the bolts to the FFW against the shoulder, and that makes for a much more secure tool.
But, I use an air tool.
Also, most impact wrenches (well, ones I've seen) have quite a relieved drive. It doesn't get square for quite a bit of depth. There isn't a lot of space between the tool and the flywheel, but if you use the non-square part of the impact tool in the install tool, you'll bugger it up.
I use an extension on the impact tool. The extension 'relief' is to a much less depth.
Yep! Mr. Steahly is good people.
I Have used a fly wheel weight on my kdx's before and this is what I found: In a drag race there is almost no difference, I had one kdx w/weight and one w/out side by side, both my bikes, 95 & 96, same mods except the weight- on the down hill the bike w/the weight it was harder to stall- Traction was a bit better w/the weight but not too noticable except in real sloppy stuff, I installed the weight mainly for my dad because he had trouble with the mid-range hit and he claimed it really helped him- I felt, in deep sand and such it was alittle harder to get the revs up but it is a 200- After my dad passed away and I sold the 95 I took the weight off the 96 and actually went the other way and turned down my fly wheel to "quicken" up the motor. I like this mod best of all for most situations. The weight now collects dust unless I ride in the slick stuff. Just a bored kdxer putting in his two cents worth.
- Thread starter
- #11
jc,
Contact me at [email protected] if you are interested in selling that dust collecting flywheel weight. Thanks!
Contact me at [email protected] if you are interested in selling that dust collecting flywheel weight. Thanks!
Yesterday I installed an 11 0z. on my bike, which has very little crank weight to begin with. Preliminary observations (just a quick spin up the road and back) is the slower rev is not noticeable, niether is the decelleration.
If I didn't put it on myself, I wouldn't have suspected anything was different.
I should be getting out today or tomorrow for some mixed conditions (technical, rocky, long flats, steep straight hills) and am very anxious to see what difference it makes out there.
Joe Chief
If I didn't put it on myself, I wouldn't have suspected anything was different.
I should be getting out today or tomorrow for some mixed conditions (technical, rocky, long flats, steep straight hills) and am very anxious to see what difference it makes out there.
Joe Chief
- Jan 8, 2000
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You'll find that it will be les likely to stall at low revs when going over slow technical terrain.
Nevada Sixx
Member
- Jan 14, 2000
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hey joe, be sure to give us a ride report after you try it out, is it on your rm250? also, try stopping half way up a hill and try to get going again, and tell us how it works...thanks
Here's how it usually works, I stop halfway up a hill, fall over, then start the bike and either walk it up the rest of the way or turn around and try again. What are you tryin' to do, kill me? :) :) Maybe I'll throw a few stoppies and seat grabs in just for good measure :laugh: :laugh:
On a more serious note, yes, it is on the RM 250 and I will try some uphill starts. I'm anxiuos to give a report and will. I'm going to try and make it out today before the rain hits.
Just as a qualifier, the bike already runs much better than stock with the mild E.G. porting that's been done and it seems to perform as well as most other bikes offroad with a little finesse, especially on the rocky uphills. I'm guessing the weight could only help.
Joe
Thanks Fuzzy, did they make the RMX in 2001? Did they have lights? I'm starting to wish I had at least a headlight. Rather than go through the trouble of the coil etc, I may just rig up a battery powered clamp on for the few occasions I would night ride.
I went on 2 rides with the new weight. The first was local. Very rocky terrain in general. For the woods the weight made it easier to do some short wide open rips. Just smoothed out the hit. I can be on the throttle wide open more often, which feels great. I was hoping the FWW would eliminate the low throttle sputter, which it did not. The bike still sounds the same, however the general feel of the bike is very smooth now at low throttle, even though the bike sputters, I barely feel it. That is very nice. As far as climbing, and I can't say for sure if it's the weight, but it climbed well. I'm talking about mostly softer straight up long coal hills. I did climb the largest hill around here that day. It has a severe angle and is very long. I've looked at that hill several times before and chickened out, It only has one path up it and has very little sign of being used much. I attempted it this time expecting to make it about halfway, but it tracked unbelievably on a maxxis 6001 that only has 1/3 tread left. Made it up twice no problem. It is by far the longest steepest hill I've ever done.
I haven't been big on long wheelies up to this point, but the few I did were easier to hold, more controlled. I'm looking forward to practicing them now where before I always felt like the bike would flip without warning, and did a few times in the past.
The second ride was on mostly faster stuff, and it ran well, perfectly. I don't notice any lack of power, it just feels smoother, still comes on strong. It still breaks loose easily, but now it's only when I do it intentionally. On this ride I did get to do a few very rocky twisty hills, although I've ridden worse. It is easier to get started from a dead stop halfway up. Even in the tough spots that might stop you in the first place.
Lastly, I tried lugging the bike as low as I could, both uphill, downhill, and on flatground. It will lug considerably more with the weight when I push it to it's limit, one point to make here is I hardly ever push it this far anyway. In the spots where I have stalled before, the very extreme rocky, long stuff that beats me up, I would expect the bike to stall less.
Overall I am very pleased with the results, although the performance changes are somewhat subtle, the rides have been 100% more enjoyable, and I am definetely less tired after I ride. I would do this mod again given the choice. I am also happy with my choice of the 11 oz, they do offer a 13 oz, and I guess that would have been a good choice for what I ride and how I ride as well. I am glad I didn't get the 7 or 9 oz. On a bike with more stock weight I would be leary of going too heavy and probably go with the lightest weight available or none at all.
To install it I had to drop clothesline down the sparkplug hole. Anything else I tried wouldn't hold the flywheel still while torquing the weight. Steahly also makes an optional flywheel holder for 9 dollars if you plan to install/uninstall the weight frequently. The original nut came off with an electric impact wrench no problem. To make room for the weight, they give you a thick plastic sidecover gasket (appx 1/8"). My shifter still clears it, but not by much. A little heat and bending could solve that.
Joe Chief
I went on 2 rides with the new weight. The first was local. Very rocky terrain in general. For the woods the weight made it easier to do some short wide open rips. Just smoothed out the hit. I can be on the throttle wide open more often, which feels great. I was hoping the FWW would eliminate the low throttle sputter, which it did not. The bike still sounds the same, however the general feel of the bike is very smooth now at low throttle, even though the bike sputters, I barely feel it. That is very nice. As far as climbing, and I can't say for sure if it's the weight, but it climbed well. I'm talking about mostly softer straight up long coal hills. I did climb the largest hill around here that day. It has a severe angle and is very long. I've looked at that hill several times before and chickened out, It only has one path up it and has very little sign of being used much. I attempted it this time expecting to make it about halfway, but it tracked unbelievably on a maxxis 6001 that only has 1/3 tread left. Made it up twice no problem. It is by far the longest steepest hill I've ever done.
I haven't been big on long wheelies up to this point, but the few I did were easier to hold, more controlled. I'm looking forward to practicing them now where before I always felt like the bike would flip without warning, and did a few times in the past.
The second ride was on mostly faster stuff, and it ran well, perfectly. I don't notice any lack of power, it just feels smoother, still comes on strong. It still breaks loose easily, but now it's only when I do it intentionally. On this ride I did get to do a few very rocky twisty hills, although I've ridden worse. It is easier to get started from a dead stop halfway up. Even in the tough spots that might stop you in the first place.
Lastly, I tried lugging the bike as low as I could, both uphill, downhill, and on flatground. It will lug considerably more with the weight when I push it to it's limit, one point to make here is I hardly ever push it this far anyway. In the spots where I have stalled before, the very extreme rocky, long stuff that beats me up, I would expect the bike to stall less.
Overall I am very pleased with the results, although the performance changes are somewhat subtle, the rides have been 100% more enjoyable, and I am definetely less tired after I ride. I would do this mod again given the choice. I am also happy with my choice of the 11 oz, they do offer a 13 oz, and I guess that would have been a good choice for what I ride and how I ride as well. I am glad I didn't get the 7 or 9 oz. On a bike with more stock weight I would be leary of going too heavy and probably go with the lightest weight available or none at all.
To install it I had to drop clothesline down the sparkplug hole. Anything else I tried wouldn't hold the flywheel still while torquing the weight. Steahly also makes an optional flywheel holder for 9 dollars if you plan to install/uninstall the weight frequently. The original nut came off with an electric impact wrench no problem. To make room for the weight, they give you a thick plastic sidecover gasket (appx 1/8"). My shifter still clears it, but not by much. A little heat and bending could solve that.
Joe Chief
