How important is helmet material?

[gospeedracer]

I'm going to be in the market for a new helmet soon. When I was shopping for my first helmet (the one I have now) a friend of mine at the time said to make sure I didn't get a plastic helmet. Since I was new to the sport, I took his advice and told the shop where I bought my helmet that I didn't want a plastic helmet. They proceeded to hand me the HJC helmet, so I take a look at the label, and see "Polycarbonate". That's plastic isn't it? I went with my Oneal helmet because it was Kevlar and Carbon Fiber.

I've been looking at helmets and I find it's difficult to find an online site that shows the materials the helmet is made of. I just love the advertising for the Fox Pilot - "Professional racers - Ezra Lusk, Ricky Carmichael, and James Dobb all depend on the Pilot... blah, blah, blah....." I don't give a rats ass that so and so wears this or that. I want to know what it's made of! Am I wasting time being concerned with this? Should I just make sure it's Dot and Snell approved?
The new Oneal SL812 says it "exceeds SNELL 2000, D.O.T (and other foreign) saftey standards". So do some of the Shoei and Arai, but then I see this:

Originally posted by Danman
Just because it costs a lot does not mean its better than other models. Shoei and Arai have to meet the same requirements for testing as the less exspensive models do. I don't think that Shoei or Arai go above or beyond the Snell or Dot rating to justify the extra cost.

So now I’m not sure what to think.

The inside liner material is going to be important to me too. The liner of my helmet is kind of scratchy and on those multiple day rides when I’m taking my helmet off and putting it back on a lot it really hurts my face. I’m leaning towards the Arai for this reason alone.

 

[Okiewan]

No materials expert but...
If it's Dot & Snell approved, the real difference in materials will be weight.
If you can swing the $, get the Arai. It's light, comfortable and the liner is the best I've seen. That being said, there are a lot of good helmets out there for less, but IMHO, the VX-Pro is worth every cent.

 

[Farmer John]

Not all Snell approved helmets are the same!
A helmet needs to displace 280 grams of energy from a weight that is dropped from 10 feet straigt up (I have forgotten the exact weight) to pass the Snell test. Most helmets are in the 290-300 gram range.
Arai's MXC-Pro is 350, the full face is 352, & Shoie's top line helmet is 340.
I have asked my freind that works for snell to get me a list of other top performers. Snell protects this list & does not publish it.

 

[Okiewan]

That's good stuff.... That list would be GREAT. My guess is, the "you paid more for the paint job" crowd would see how wrong they've been :cool:
I do wonder what the difference in ratings translates to in terms of protection.

 

[gospeedracer]

So do you know what is the cause for the differences in the displacement amounts?
Is it the outer shell material, the inner materials (foam), the design of the helmet, all of the above, or a combo?

 

[gospeedracer]

Originally posted by Okiewan
the "you paid more for the paint job" crowd would see how wrong they've been

The Shoei and Aria helmets with the nice paint jobs ($420-$570), are about $100 or so more than the plain white or black ones (aprox $400)
So I don't buy the "your paying for the paint job" thing in the case of these helmets.

 

[Camstyn]

Regarding the liners, I have to agree that Arai has the nicest liner in the business, not to mention the best venting. I really wish my VX-Pro fit my head a bit better, or I wouldn't be selling it. As it stands, I've worn a Shoei VFX-2 for the past few years and bought a new Arai VX-Pro and a Shoei VFXR. Both brand new, the VX-Pro was the nicer helmet of the two but the VFX-R fit my head better. I'd recommend trying them on.

What size helmet do you wear, GSR? I happen to know where you can get an incredible deal on a brand new Arai VX-Pro. ;)

 

[gospeedracer]

Originally posted by Cam Mitchell
What size helmet do you wear, GSR?

My Oneal helmet is either a small or an extra small. :confused:

 

[smb_racing]

The liner in my HJC AC-X1 is the coolmax material, very comfortable and really keeps the persperation down. The helmet is vented extremely well, and the helmet is light. I've noticed carbon fiber helmets on the market, which seem like a good idea, but there's the expense factor there too. The AC-X1 I have is a kevlar composite of some sort, didn't get the exact specs. It's DOT and Snell approved also. I had my last HJC for two years and it hadn't taken *too many* hard hits, but I decided that it would be a good idea to replace it though, seeing as how helmets tend to have a shelf life. It's a budget minded helmet, but the best I've seen in the price range. Being prominently a trail rider, with an occasional race thrown in, I can't see myself paying $450 for a helmet that I'll replace in a year, guess I only have a $200 head :silly:

 

[High Desert XR400]

Helmets???????

I just replaced my HJC helmet after a hard head first landing into bowling ball sized lava rocks.:confused: I survived with bruises across my forehead and a sore neck and shoulder. The helmet on the other hand was busted up pretty good, but it did its job.
After trying on atleast five or six different helmets, including those that had the fancy rider endorsed paint jobs. I found that the one that fit my head the best and was most comfortable was a new HJC CL-X4.
It is a matter of personal preference. Try on several different helmets and after you have had a few on your head you will know which one feels the best. I would also make sure that it is Snell and DOT rated. Good luck!:D

 

[LWilson250]

I'll put another good word in for the HJC helmets. I have a CL-X3 and now use a CL-X4. The X4 is a great helmet, I put on a Shoei and it was not as nice as the X4. I was surprised, weight wise, the Shoei and the X4 seem to be in the same ballpark, style wise, the HJC looks a lot like the Shoei. Price wise, $150 for the HJC, $475 for the Shoei.

Lee W.

 

[MikeT]

Bell Moto7

Don't forget the Bell. One thing most overlook is the amount of coverage that a helmet gives your face. Put a Moto7 on and notice that it covers your jaw and comes down pretty far. Then go and put on a Shoei, Fox or one of their clones. Take a look at your jaw hanging out the bottom and how much more of your neck is exposed. The Moto7 has a Carbon Fiber, Kevlar, and fiberglass blended shell. It also has a completely removable liner for cleaning. I highly recommend this helmet. You should really take a look at if youare truly concerned about the amount of coverage you get with a helmet.

MikeT

 

[JuliusPleaser]

Since you asked. . .

I brought home a Shoei VFX-R yesterday. So far, I really like it. My jaw isn't exposed, but the helmet doesn't offer as much coverage as my O'Neal SL 810. The Shoei feels a little lighter than the O'Neal, but it's not by a huge amount.

Check out (Bob's Cycle Supply) for some smokin' deals on really nice helmets.

I got my 2002 Pro Circuit VFX-R from a local dealer for less than $350 out the door. :cool:

 

[cujet]

When we are looking for abrasion resistance and outright impact resistance, we use Kevlar in the aviation industry. For out right strength and stiffness we use carbon fiber. For a nice strong product with some of the properties of both we use an aviation grade of Fiberglass. however, Fiberglass ends up quite a bit heavier. Blends of the above can achieve some of the desired properties of each. We never use polycorbonate or other injection molded plastics for structural components.

With this in mind, it seems to me that for motorcycle helmets a blend of carbon/Kevlar is best, followed by a quality fiberglass.

Chris

 

[tx246]

cant believe it

the most important material in anybodys helmet is the friggin styrofoam. the only thing that fancy outter shell does is hold paint and keep the styrofoam from being damaged from abrasion. like it or not motorcycle helmets protect your head absorbing energy............mostly from within the helmet. ever see bicycle helmets? they would probably do as good in a crash as our motolids. they just couldnt handle the scrapes and minor bumps as well in a moto environment. of course you get full face, and roost protection with a moto helmet.

any good scientist will tell you that a lighter overall helmet is better in a crash due to the old " object in motion tends to stay in motion and lighter means less forces to decellerate" mojo.

high end helmets cost more because they are "nicer" ie much better liners, fastening systems, cooler graphics, better fits ect. not because they are inherently safer.

hate to say it, but no helmet can stop your head from 30mph to 0 in 2 feet. its just not possible. helmet manufacturers will tell you that the damage that they are trying to prevent occurs in the fall from where your head is while sitting on a bike to the ground. doesnt matter if you are going 30mph or 0 your head will hit the ground at the same speed. if you are doing 30mph and land on your head, hopefully you are sliding. if you are hoping your helmet will save you from a sudden stop, you are a dreamer.

those of you who think carbon or fiberglass is better than plastic as a shell because its stiffer and stronger consider this. i put you inside of an armored truck. seems like you are safe until i throw you over a cliff. the outside of the armored truck would look relatively the same but you wouldnt because you suffered from uncontrolled decelleration. same applies to your head inside your helmet

these are just my thoughts.

i have an arai for the street because of the much better fit and finish. great shield and lower noise levels.

ive used hjc, kbc for dirt because of the short life expectancy as we tend to fall over on dirt much more often. everytime your helmet hits the ground ( even if you are doing 3mph in a corner) check your liner. the styro is what saves your noggin. last bit of advice is dont paint your helmet unless you can take the styro out. paint thinners break the styro down.

 

[cujet]

TX, good post. I agree that the styrofoam is the most important aspect of a helmet. However, for certain impacts there is a puncture resistance or localized load factor. There are many cases of older injection molded helmets splitting in half at the seam. Polycarbonate is much less likely to protect you in a high speed crash where your head hits a rock or other hard object with small surface area. There is at least one instance where during a race a handlebar punctured a plastic helmet, causing great injury. A rare instance such as this could be prevented by better armor.

I still maintain that it is important to use the best materials available. One never can predict what kind of protection your helmet may need to provide.

I would rather spend a few more dollars.

Chris

 

[tx246]

i agree with u

cujet, you are right about helmet outer layer and puncture type injuries. the two piece mold in plastic is not as safe as some of the other materials in that regard. i fear that most people who do buy 400dollar helmets use em way past their ability to protect due to previous impacts. all it takes is one tip over to destroy the integrity of the styro liner. i myself dont care for the plastic shell but on the other side some of those are lighter and are probably better in preventing neck injury. i just think the mid priced helmets are the best value for me as far as protection. i can replace my helmet twice for the cost of a highend helmet. there are some great fiberglass shell helmets in the under 200 range. i guess what i really want to stress is check the inside of your helmet often and replace it when it needs it. and price is more a reflection of dodads and appearance and not just safety level.

 

[OnAnySunday]

Originally posted by gospeedracer :
"I just love the advertising for the Fox Pilot - "Professional racers - Ezra Lusk, Ricky Carmichael, and James Dobb all depend on the Pilot... blah, blah, blah....." I don't give a rats ass that so and so wears this or that. I want to know what it's made of!"

Bless you. But dont you want to be as fast as RC and those guys???? LOL
In all seriousness though the lighter the helmet is (without giving up any imact protection that is) the better.
A heavier helmet has a higher chance of giving you a "whiplash" type of neck injury than a lighter one does.
Especially in cases involving (im risking my life here -w- this statement) women and children who have less neck and upper body strenght.
Even though i wear a HJC fiberglass unit, if my wife rode, id probably buy her a kevlar/carbongraphite one.
Besides women have more BRAINS to protect, right??????
(OAS trying desperetly to save his own butt)

"The inside liner material is going to be important to me too. "

Definetly get one -w- a removable washable liner.
I didnt , and i sure wish i did............:eek:

 

[Patman]

NO! A bicycle helmey WILL NOT protect as well as a moto helmet! I have a frend that crashed his Mt. bike hard and his helmet pretty much turned to chunks, he was out cold. This was a high end Bell helmet that was about 8 months old. I have to replace my Bell just due to use and sweat. I'm going to consider something a little more heavy duty like a Bell BMX type lid. There are a lot of trials riders that wear the bicycle lids but in competition they are not allowed and personally I think it's a stupid risk. Sure your moving slower but it's generally in MUCH more technical areas with lots of stuff to pop your bean on.

That being said my MSR System 6 has been a very good lid. Fits well, comfortable, flows air well and is reasonably light for a day of riding. My NZI trials helemt is a whopping 25oz made from carbonfiber, fits well and looks trick too :D . I think the most important thing is how a helemt fits. If the helemt fits well and has the DOT AND Snell certifications then lighter is better so long as it doesn't sacrific the protection. The shell DOES make a difference. A poly shell will be fine for almost any crash but when there is a puncture such as from a rock or foot peg the high tech materials will provide better protection by distributing the load across the surface area much better than a polycarb will. No? Then why are bulletproof panels made of these materials? The flip side is that wacking your head on a blunt rock will result in a trashed lid no matter which one your wearing so make a choice. If you got the money to spend go with the highest dollar helemt but if you find a middle of the road one that fits all your needs (and head) why not use it and save the extra money for other stuff? Speedy do yourself a huge favor and go to several shops and try on every different helemt you can find.

 

[tx246]

lemme clarify

patman,
i agree with you on everything you have said. helmet builders will tell ya that they slow your head down with the styrofoam. the shell is there to protect the foam and prevent punctures to the foam and head. i dont mean to imply we should ride around in bicycle helmets. did your mountain bike buddy hit his head on something that might puncture ie a rock? that styro shell is supposed to break up. if it broke up from the outside due to a puncture from a rock than yes a fully shelled foam would of been better. people on trials i think would take your view as there are lots of things hanging around that would punch holes in a bicycle helmet. besides bicycle helmets have no face/jaw protection. they say the ultimate helmet is:

light......to protect against whiplash
strong(shell)............to displace loads that might puncture the shell and comprimise the foam and/or actually make it your head
got full jaw coverage
and finally.........uncomprimised foam liner to decellerate your head


i guess the bottom line for helmet shells is this. strength is good for impact resistance to protect the foam. in itself the shell protects the foam so it can take the force of the head and decellerate it in a controlled manner. i feel that most people consider the shell as the most important part when in fact it isnt. if it was proven that the shell alone did the protecting, then we would all ride around in old army helmets. to be honest with you i think the manufacturers should do more research in the foam end of the helmet.

 

[IBWFO]

I have heard that from a safety standpoint the new M2R helmets are the highest rated helmets you can buy.
Check them out they have a website.

D

 

[MikeT]

Originally posted by cujet
I still maintain that it is important to use the best materials available. One never can predict what kind of protection your helmet may need to provide.

Chris

I would also ask myself "How valuable is my head" and then consider what helmet to buy. That's what I did.

 

[Patman]

My buddy's head just hit the ground, no rocks or stumps within 30 feet. He had a diabetic blackout and just conked over. Pretty scary considering the low speed at the time. My mention of trials riders was because a lot of them do wear bicycle helemts and just recently the local events are requiring a proper lid. As far as value of my head? Well not always does dollars equal the best protection. I'd much rather have a 2 year old middle priced lid than a 6 year old mega buck lid that has the same rating because of degraded materials from sweat & UV let alone the occasional drop.:)

 

[MikeT]

Originally posted by Patman
As far as value of my head? Well not always does dollars equal the best protection. I'd much rather have a 2 year old middle priced lid than a 6 year old mega buck lid that has the same rating because of degraded materials from sweat & UV let alone the occasional drop.:)

Correct. Patman I see you understand what I said. I said how "valuable" not how much does it cost. The solid white Moto7 costs much less than my Yamaha of Troy painted lid, does the solid one protect any less? No. Thats why this thread is importand because it didn't ask about price and cost of helmets, it askes about materials. Unfortunately the better protecting materials usually cost more but thats why you must look into construction and condition (if the helmet is older).:D

 

[AngryCandy]

What is the best way to check the integrity of the styrofoam liner? I have conked my head several times with my current helmet, and a quick visual inspection of the foam reveals nothing. Are indentations and cracks going to be easily visible?