New bike for newer rider, tight trails

[BigBobT]

I’m pretty new to dirt riding and am looking for some advice on purchasing a new bike. The quickie background is my son (14 years old now) started riding last year on an XR100. The bike was fine for him to learn on but too small. Earlier this year we bought a new XR250 that both of us could use. I enjoy riding the XR250 and am seriously considering buying another one this fall. However, before I do, I’m trying to consider my other options.

Both bikes will be used for tight trail riding in Michigan. My son is already a better rider in dirt then I’ll probably ever be. I’ve been a street rider for years with a lot of miles under my belt but the dirt is still rather new. However, I’m enjoying riding the 250 a lot and see it as a sport I will continue with for a long time.

I’m only interested in a four stroke and also do not want a really tall bike since I’m about 5’6”. At this point my riding will be in Michigan but can possibly see some trips out west down the road. A friend of mine who does a lot of riding and racing told me I should check out the KTM 250EXC four stroke at our local dealer. It was rather obvious the improved components, etc. that come standard with KTM along with a higher price. I really like the estart and the fact the local dealer seems much better then any of our Honda shops. With reading two articles in the current issue of REV, it sounds like the KTM 450 EXC might be easier to handle on tight trails then the 250 because of the power characteristics. They both are the same weight, size, and suspension. Somewhere on the internet I read that the KTM 4 strokes are not designed to run for long trail riding and that the valves should be adjusted every 15 hours (huh?).

So, any thoughts on if I’m being stupid to even consider the KTM? Is there something else maybe more appropriate that doesn’t have a 40” seat height? I wish I could test ride several bikes including both flavors of the KTM and the XR400. Thanks for any insight and sorry for such a long first post.

 

[mackay]

Just playing devils advocate here but if your son is already that much better than you maybe HE needs the new bike??? :debil:

 

[woodsy]

Great minds must really think alike Mac!! I thought the same thing when I read his posting.. You should keep the XR250 and get your son something he can really grow on! Look closely at the WR250F Yamaha! I am from Michigan too and have spent many years riding the MCCCT and the loops here in the lower half. I belong to the CCC and have TONS of freinds with a huge variety of modern bikes (even the exotics like Husaberg and VOR) at my fingre tips. IMO the KTM line is AWESOME, that 300 EXC of my friend Larry's is with out a doubt, one of the most woods worthy bikes ever produced but it is 2 stroke and exspensive! Again the second closes bike within "reasonable" dollars (I can get one for you brand new out of Canada for $4400) is that little WR250F. I think this would be a great 1 for your son because: Right out of the box they will SMOKE an XR400, they weigh 31 pounds less then an XR400 (I am comparinig them to the 400 because I just sold one to a guy in CA and did all the comparisons before I shipped it), much more nimble in the woods, GO FAST mods are free once he gets used to the bike (which will take ohhh about an afternoon of riding knowing these kids now adays!!).
Personally if I were you I would join the CCC and go to the next major outing. GO from truck to truck asking questions and taking up offers to test ride the bikes!! You would be shocked at how friendly this group of guys/gals are!! We have ALL been in you set of shoes and understand how important the decision to purchase is. If it were one I was plannning on riding, I would buy NOTHING until I had a chance to sample!
2 pennies
Woodsy
By the way, you will be amazed to find out how much YOU will advance once you get away from that XR!! All of these "new generation" bikes are CONFIDENCE INSPIRING!! You buy a WR for your son and you will both have one in a very short time!

 

[woodsy]

Hey Bob, I forgot about your KTM question - I have lots of riding friends that I have done 100 plus miles of trail per day (hard riding Michigan woods) and NEVER have I heard or encountered anything like you are deplicting!! You might want to go to the KTM site here at DRN and ask specific questoins concerning the 450 and its long run capability. I will be shocked if you hear anything other than (this bike will run around the clock!!), if you ever have the opportuntiy to make one of the big enduro or harescramble races here in MI you will see why I say that - ALL THAT ORANGE IN THE PARKING AREA AINT PUMPKINS GROWING!!
WOODSY

 

[BigBobT]

Thanks for all the detailed responses. Yes, I was thinking it made more sense to get my son the new bike. However, after he has had two new ones in less than a year, I think it is my turn. If I do decide I want an XR250, then I'll consider keeping the one we have and letting him get something else.

That being said, I'm still really interested in the KTM. I'm going to be next to another dealer tomorrow (Grand Haven, MI) so I'm going to talk to them and get a little more insight into some of my concerns.

I'll also look into the WR250F but think it is just too tall for me.

Finally, Woodsy, is there a website for the CCC? I would like to get more info and probably join. Sounds like a good way for me to get more involved in the sport.

 

[70 marlin]

either one more xr250 or a ktm 400 or 450 depends on how deep your pockets are.

 

[BigBobT]

With the KTM, it will take several deep pockets. :silly:

That being said, if I would really be happy with it then it would be worth it to me.

 

[beer_stud_76]

my best friend just bought a 96 KTM SC400. its a 4 stroke and is without a doubt the finest dirt bike i've ever ridden. it delivers MONSTER power in a very linear and predictable way, it sips gas, it starts with 1 kick every time (assuming the fuel shut-off valve wasn't left in the "on" position for weeks), the suspension is plush and apparently bottomless, it can be bogged, it can be over revved, it does roll-on wheelies like a CR250. its damn near perfect. if you find a good deal on one, don't hesitate.


jeremiah

 

[woodsy]

Bob: The CCC web page is www.cycleconservationclub.org great organization and a very worthy cause!! Before u go KTM locally I would check with Ludington KTM dealer too. They are a brand new shop and the last time I was up there they had some SUPER deals going and even allowed a test drive on the 520!!! Seem like a fantastic dealer (not to cut Lake cycle down cause they are good too!) with maybe better prices!!
I ran with a guy from Lincoln hills to Boon yesterday. He was riding a new CRF450. I had my hands full staying with him on my KDX250 - that CRF is truly magic! Just a little something to ponder... I love throwing out those little statements just to make these forums fun!
Lets get together and ride sometime - sounds like we are neighbors - I live in Ravenna with lots of "play ground room" to go play on!!
Woodsy

 

[MWEISSEN]

BigBobT:

You sure came to the right place to get a lot of advice on a bike! And, guess what? I'll give you some more!

I too live in Michigan, just south of you guys, in the Grand Rapids area.

I started back riding on an XR250, and the bike certainly handled tight trail, once I put a few hundred dollars into it (or more!). I still think it's a pretty good bike, but once you start getting at least semi-serious, the forks deflect easy, the shock heats up and goes away, the power isn't there....

I thought an XR400 might be the next answer. During the test ride, I kept having to look at the numbers on the seat to make sure it wasn't a 250. I didn't feel any different, maybe a little more power....my modified 250 felt it was putting the same as a stock 400.

I understand about "it's my turn" for a new bike! It's YOUR money buying the bike, why not!!??

All that said, I don't think you'd go wrong with the KTM450. Yeah it costs more, but you won't have to buy anything else for it. The components are first-rate, and the motor has proven reliable.

If you don't mind going used, I know where you can get a 400 with super-redone suspension. PM back if interested.

Also check out the Michigan Trail Riders area under the Regional Chapter/Eastern section on this site. You'll find a bunch of Michiganders setting up rides there, and more than a few of them ride orange!

 

[BigBobT]

Well, I'm more confused then ever (my wife didn't think that was possible).

I still have a strong pull for the KTM's, just seem so much more refined then the offerings from the big 4. However, the more I read hear and on KTMTalk, the more concerned I am about maintaining one. Frequent needs for both valve adjusts and oil changes are a concern along with that neither seem that simple to do.

My son's buddy just got a CRF450 the other day. Hope to be able to ride it next week. I saw him ride it briefly the other night and it looked like a kid doing drivers ed with a Ferrari. Scary.

I am going to be checking out Honda's website on September 13th when they are suppose to have announcements for upcoming products. Maybe some major updates to the XR's???

I do appreciate the link to CCC which I'll join and the suggestion for the Ludington dealer Woodsy.

 

[woodsy]

Hey Bob: A word of waring about that CRF (this should be printed on a sticker placed on top off the tank!!): Riding this bike has proven addictive to 99% of all riders!!!
IF YOU RIDE IT YOU WILL WANT ONE - GUARENTEED!!
Thanks for the info about the Honda site update in Sept (didnt know that!!). Maybe they will have a wide ratio woods bike for us this time or a new CRF250 or BOTH!!
Lets get together and ride sometime...
Woodsy

 

[MWEISSEN]

BigBobT, I sent you a PM message.

 

[SpeedyManiac]

At your height, I would definitely look at bikes with e-start. The KTMs are excellent bikes to look at, or a 2003 WR250F or WR450F. The XR400R is actually quite tall, you may have trouble reaching the ground, or starting it on hills. Good luck, have fun!!!!!

 

[beer_stud_76]

bigbob -

LOL!

. . .honda updating the XR's!. . .

ooo. . .criminy thats a good one!

if you are hoping for big red to update the XR then your hope is in vain. that being said you ought to take a look at the ol' XR 400. they are quite tame in stock form and very easy to hop-up as you improve. and if there is a simpler bike to maintain than an XR, then i haven't seen it.


jeremiah

 

[BigBobT]

Yup, I think it is doubtfull Honda will have any major XR changes other then the new CRF230 replacing the XR200. If they do announce something, it won't be until an '04 model at the earliest and I need something sooner then that.

So, the more I read and here, the closer I am to thinking the 450EXC. Considering weight, estart, seat height, etc., sounds like the closest to my wants (hard to call them needs).

 

[BigBobT]

Just wanted to put an ending post on this thread to say I did buy another bike last week. Since I received a lot of advice from others here I wanted to share what I ended up with and how things are now working out.

So, I bought, drum roll please.....

A 2003 KTM 450EXC and absolutely love it as does my son. I'm more satisfied with the bike then I ever thought I would be. I really like the ergos, great suspension (I had the dealer add 1" spacers to lower it and revalve the fork), tons of power, and of course the estart.

Even though I'm a novice dirt rider I'm really comfortable with the bike. The power is very controllable and can be ridden slow. However, when you want the power it is always on tap. Now I just need to work on my skills to take better advantage of the great bike.

Thanks again for everyone's assistance.

 

[beer_stud_76]

sweet

 

[woodsy]

YOU DA MAN BOB!! Congrats on the new scoot - THOSE KTMS ARE AWESOME!!
See ya in the woods!
Woodsy