new KTM, bad suspension?

426 Pilot · Jan 27, 2003

What's up 300 pilots?... I just bought a 03 300mxc and broke it in thiss past weekend. I'm coming off a 01yz250 set up for scrambles. The new steed seems to have awesome power (although I never really got on it for a long period of time due to the break-in procedure).... Here's my problem THE SUSPENSION IS TERRIBLE!!!!! I am used to a bike that can slam through anything with confidence. I know the suspension will also break in a bit but it's not even close to being balanced or set up for cross country/hare scramble type riding... which the bike is intended for. I have to be honest, it was one of the scariest experiences I have had in a while. The bike felt like it couldn't handle speed or the power of the engine.

I didn't mess with the clickers too much, but I did crank in the compression quite a bit on the forks to help with the diving... didn't do much.

I can't imagine that anyone is riding with the stock suspension or set-up on these bikes, so what's the concensus on a set-up that won't make me have to check my shorts every time I get on the gas in anything beyond 2nd gear.

OBTW I haven't swapped the stabalizer from the yz yet. I know this will make a difference, but it won't change the fact that the stock suspension is just wrong. I know these things can be set up well, I just need some ideas where to start before I do what I always end up doing (stiffer springs and JN revalve).

Any ideas on this bike would be helpful.... almost forgot, I weigh 200lbs and I'm a semi-fast d36 B scrambles rider.

Thanks,

Jon
D36 250 class..... make that open class now.
#217

KenR · Jan 28, 2003

Congrats on the new bike! WP suspension, particularly the forks, are known to take a bit of break in time before they start working well. You'll probably still want to revalve it at some point. When they're set up right, they're awesome.

mxbundy · Jan 28, 2003

I will probably get flamed for this, but here goes!

I own a 02 400sx and after spending alot of money on the suspension I have come to the conclusion that it will never be up to my Yam. bikes standards. :|
In fact I am gonna sell it and get a WR I think. Or maybe a CR450.
I have ridden several besides mine, all with setups by the major susp. shops and they just didnt perform as good as I liked. You can get good small bump absorbsion or good bottoming resistence, but not both.
I think the shock and the linkless system just need a few more years of development.
If I had the money I would try an Ohlins on the back, but I think I will just save that money to set up the stuff on my new bike.
Now this is just my humble opinion. I like everything else about the bike.

But ask around before you get your suspension done, use a shop that does alot of KTM bikes. Make sure that they have a good offroad base line of settings, not just softened up mx settings.
You see the problem is at your weight, you will be at the limit as far as the available heavier rate springs. I had to get a shock spring custom wound for my 265# weight.
You are right at Junior Lafferty`s weight, so Enduro Engineering would be the shop that I would use. In hindsite I wish I would have used them.

bundy

enmerdeur · Jan 28, 2003

I just don't get it when I hear things like this. My 02' 300 EXC is the first KTM I have owned out of the 30 years I have been riding and it is by far the most confidence inspiring bike both at speed and on the trail I have ever owned. This is with bone stock suspension. Compared to my 300 all the Japanese bikes I have owned (YZF,KX,CR,YZ) feel like they are hinged in the middle.

I must be doing something wrong.

MrLuckey · Jan 28, 2003

I think Jeremy just might know a thing or two about the KTM's. I would check out his suspension forum and either post something, e-mail him or give him a call.

MikeS · Jan 28, 2003

426

1. Give Ample break in time, 4-6 2hour races and a friends 450EXC is finally settling in.

2. Research suspension shops very well, based on your skill level. A well informed tuner is very important. I have ridden a bike that was raced by Mike Lafferty and I found it difficult to handle, since I am 1/4 as fast (maybe less).

Speedway · Jan 28, 2003

426,
Also set your sag once the suspension is broken in, I too had awful problems with the stock setting until it was broken in and the sag was set. Hang in there and good luck

Gardener · Jan 28, 2003

I agree with 426 and MXbundy, to an extent. The suspension on my 300 was horrible stock as well. The fork needed heavier springs and a revalve and now it is not too bad, just about as good as a stock wr250f. The shock is a little harsh but doesn't work all that bad to me. I'm fork sensitive and shock dead though. At 200# the stock spring rates are too light for you.

mxbundy · Jan 28, 2003

enmerdeur,

I never said that the bike was not confidence inspiring our that it handled bad.
The suspension action and handling are not the same.
I personally like my bike, I like the way that it handles, and I like the way that it fits my 6'4" frame. Much better than my Yam. bikes.
I even like the way it corners ( once I got a stiff enough rear spring ), some guys have to go to aftermarket clamps before they are happy.
But the suspension just is not as plush as my Yam. bikes.
I have the unique advantage of being able to ride them and compare.
And to even the score the 400 Yamy and the 400 sx were done by the same company. And there is no comparison. The Yam is down right plush with excellant bottoming control. The sx has good bottoming control but is really harsh.
But I think that the problem is in my SIZE! The Yam. and there linkage can better accomadate my size and abillity level. Can a KTM work for someone who is a normal size rider, absolutly!
Which brings us to 426pilot who is above average in weight. But he may be able to dial his in because he is on the cuff for the available spring rates.
Now with that said, suspension is a very personal thing. What works for one rider may not work for another. And for this reason I suggest that he do his homework and work with a shop that is into the type of riding that he does. Some shops are good at mx but maynot be the best choice for offroad. And this is the mistake that I made.
Can my bike be made better, absolutley, but do I want to sink another 600 to 800 bucks in it, no!

bundy

UKcr125rider · Jan 28, 2003

I've heard a lot of SX owners, majority being SX125's have been complaining about the forks on the '03's. They seem to think they are waytoo stiff and out of balance with the shock! Most are opting for revalving and lighter fork springs which isn't so nice when you've just spent your hard earned money on the bike itself .

xrsforever · Jan 28, 2003

MX Tech can unleash the handling so it works great. Personally I think the EXC is MUCH better suited box stock for HARESCRAMBLES and XCOUNTRY. The MXC is too stiff

little jeff · Jan 28, 2003

I had my 300EXC 02' revalved by an MX Tech affilliate in WA state. Works way better than stock, much plusher through the woods and going over woops sections in the trails.
Little Jeff

426 Pilot · Jan 29, 2003

Hey guy's, thanks for all the replies. I really need to put more time on the bike and mess with different settings before I decide what I need done. The worst thing you can do is take a bike to a suspension tuner and just tell him to fix it. I need to get a better idea of exactly what it is doing wrong so my suspension doc can give me the right perscription. Stiffer fork spring are a given, probably .44's . I actually gave my suspension guy a buzz to let him know of my new aquisition and to get an idea of what he has been doing to these bikes for guys my size and riding style (it helps that I ride with him once in a while) and he said that I could probably get away with keeping the stock shock spring and installing a bladder kit to the shock (not sure what this is) getting the .44's up front and revalve both ends. He said he's been doing a few KTM's a week and the local shop where I got my bike actually recommended him as well.... before I told them I have used him for my other bikes.

There's a big national HS this weekend here in Nor Cal but I'm off to Hawaii for a week (work related, don't get too jealous) so I'm missing it... Gives me more time to get the bike dialed before the next race. I'll post whatever ends up working to get the suspension to my liking. I know it can be done.

Jon

marklb · Jan 30, 2003

I have an 03 EXC and have been working with Factory Connection_Terry! They have alot of testing and even though I do not like boxing up and shipping my stuff off. Give Terry a call, one of the guys that works there has a 03 200 and when I got my stuff back and set it up with 120mm of sag(i know sounds like alot) I was sceptacle too. Bottom line I have called them many times and have been treated just super. I am sold on their services Give them a call and they will help you figure out what might help! Mark

Barbarian · Jan 31, 2003

120mm of sag? I've sent my suspension to a reputable shop twice. I'm not happy with the shock. In all honesty, it feels like the 110mm of sag, which is more than they recomend, that I'm running is not enough. Did they recomend you run 120mm??

mark76 · Feb 2, 2003

its too bad that an out of the box race bike can have such problems, and especially when you pay good money for them.
A friend if mine had the same experience, he's an experienced enduro and motocross racer, and he said he had more scary moments on his KTM exc 450 in the 3 months he had it than in the 15 years he's been riding. when he softned it up for rutted wood type going, (which is most paces in Wales) the thing would tankslap like a bitch at speed on an straight. He tried changing the spring, all sorts of settings, in the end it was just impossibe. so he's sold it on for a yam 426.

RTKLR1 · Feb 2, 2003

I have ridden a 01 400 exc with enduro engineering revalved fork and shock, it is awesome,doesnt deflect and the bike stays flat. stock it feels out of balance and rocks back and forth alot more.

kathy127 · Feb 2, 2003

I have a mxc 200 and am having troublewith the shock sag also. IT is way too stiff or harsh. It is bumpy riding from the pits! My problem is that I weigh 125 obs and the spring is too stiff and there is no where to go. Anyone out there a 'light' person who has found an answer to the shock harshness? Otherwise, love the power and delivery.

OrangeCrush · Feb 3, 2003

Anyone that has responded to this post that does not Own or Rode the 03 models need not compare......

The 03's 48mm forks are as stiff as a board.........I posted what happemed to me on KTM talk.com.......

Got my bike in a box from canada (cheaper), prepped it for a week, fluids, bolt checks, locktight, heat cycles, carb adjustments etc...............

Rode the bike up and down my street slowly to break the motor in and to see how it felt compared to my 01 300EXC............

Bike felt great!, felt lighter, slimmer, tiny compared to the 01.
Then on December 14th at 11 am I took her to the dirt (mind you I didnt have a clear head, after witnessing a fatal car accident earlier that morning.)

Put on all my gear (good thing I did) warmed her up. then started my engine break in ride. Well I got to a small, shallow wash went it in and came out of it , hit a small woop bump and found myself on my back after the front forks pogo sticked my a$$ over... I flew through the air backwards at a high rate of speed cuz it all happened so fast that in the process of looping the bike I twisted the throttle full and preloaded way up into the air!

Came down on that woop, bending me over backwards and breaking a piece of my spine in the process. I'm still numb and have no feeling on one a$$ cheek, but thank the lord my back is fine.

I rode this bike in the dirt for 3 minutes before completely destroying the subframe, stock silencer, head pipe got bent also, rear tail light, fender etc.....

Bike is fixed 700 bucks later, but my gawd I need to do something about these sorry a$$ forks! I guess I'll drop the compression settings to completely soft for a few 100 miles!

Please be careful out there all, put on "ALL" your gear because you NEVER know what's going to happen!

...Crush

motomickey · Feb 3, 2003

I'm a vote for MXtech too. I have a 02 250 sx with the previous version forks-not nearly as tunable as the 03s. Also second the break in time-makes a difference. After MXtech did my suspension, the forks work fantastic...as good as any honda or yamaha etc I have ridden.

Brains · Feb 3, 2003

I'm not so sure that you have to be on a 03 to get that feeling or check in your pants after riding. I recently (3 rides ago) bought a 99 200exc and the first time I got onto it, nearly killed myself about four times in a 6 hour ride. The suspension kicked me like I had just stuck my fingers in a plug. What really #$#@# me off was that I had spend years dreaming about owning a KTM. After owning two KDX's a RM and spending time on a RMX, YZ250 and GG200 I thought the way to become a better rider was to own a KTM. After all this is a "works" bike .....right? and it cost a lot of money.

I know I am throwing flames around there, but I am straight disappointed that I bought a bike with such high expectations and have to now go and spend more money on making the suspension safe and ride able.

As for the rest of the bike, best thing, I have owned.

Shaw520 · Feb 4, 2003

The WP suspension gets a bad rap from people who are not familiar with the proper set-up proceedures,...and for those folks, they should stick with the Jap manufacturing.  I dont think I ever got on a KTM, and felt  the suspension was setup correctly for me. But once dialed in to your specific likes/needs, the WP suspension will excell in performance. I'm not going to compare WP to other suspension manufaturers, becuase any suspension can be taylored to ones likings. I buy KTM because I prefer the rest of the KTM package, and the WP suspension can be taylored to perform as well as the rest of them.

Just wanted to add; During the 'break-in period' you can run 2.5 weight fork oil, especially in the 03"s, it helps alot.

Barbarian · Feb 5, 2003

Does any body else run lots of sag on there KTM 200exc?? Mine feels best with a lighter sprig that gives me 115mm of sag with about 30mm of static sag. This is different from what mine and most other re-valve companies are using.

Gardener · Feb 5, 2003

Don't you find that headshake increases as sag increases?

Barbarian · Feb 5, 2003

No headshake goes down. Having more sag choppers the bike out more and reduces headshake.

new KTM, bad suspension?

426 Pilot

KenR

mxbundy

Sponsoring Member

enmerdeur

MrLuckey

Fire Marshall Ed

MikeS

Speedway

Gardener

mxbundy

Sponsoring Member

UKcr125rider

xrsforever

little jeff

426 Pilot

marklb

Barbarian

mark76

RTKLR1

kathy127

OrangeCrush

motomickey

Brains

Shaw520

Barbarian

Gardener

Barbarian

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new KTM, bad suspension?

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