What is the true cause of ARM PUMP
- Thread starter PWDAD
- Start date
- Apr 11, 2001
- 558
- 0
I've got the same problem. I find it's from the dreadded death grip. I know that I should grip w/my legs more, but for some reason my brain just won't transfer the info.
Arm pump occurs when the muscle(s) fill up with so much blood that it causes pain. Try something that helped me and several others. Go to the grocery store and buy a product called "Propel", which is made by Gatorade. Drink at least 2 bottles an hour before you ride and contine 1 after every moto. I was amazed at how this helped me and seveeral of my buddies are hooked now too.
Regards
Regards
It's high in minerals, low in carbs. It has potassium and Niacin too.
That reminds me, I'm heading to pick my son up from school and hitting the night track: Time to pick up some propel.
I'm not saying this is the "cure-all", but it really has helped me tremendously.
That reminds me, I'm heading to pick my son up from school and hitting the night track: Time to pick up some propel.
I'm not saying this is the "cure-all", but it really has helped me tremendously.
Banana's
are a good source of potassium as well.
Eat a banana or two about 30 minutes before you ride with plenty of water, this seems to help also.
But what I have found works best is lots of seat time and confidence in your riding abilities. If I'm not comfortable with the track or surface, I tend to get arm pump. If I feel comfortable and confident, rarely get arm pump.
I was just off for 8 weeks for a rotator cuff repair. Other than PT for 4 weeks, I haven't really done any excercise. I rode Sun. for the first time and didn't get any arm pump even though I was turning good lap times. Of course, I was on one of the tracks I'm most familiar with and I didn't push myself to my limits.
are a good source of potassium as well.
Eat a banana or two about 30 minutes before you ride with plenty of water, this seems to help also.
But what I have found works best is lots of seat time and confidence in your riding abilities. If I'm not comfortable with the track or surface, I tend to get arm pump. If I feel comfortable and confident, rarely get arm pump.
I was just off for 8 weeks for a rotator cuff repair. Other than PT for 4 weeks, I haven't really done any excercise. I rode Sun. for the first time and didn't get any arm pump even though I was turning good lap times. Of course, I was on one of the tracks I'm most familiar with and I didn't push myself to my limits.
I think it's the Niacin that is supposed to help the arm-pump, but it didn't help me tonight. I still can't get used to the 02 CR 250 compared to the 01 426!
The arm-pump was more prevalent than ever, but having been off for 3 months with a broken arm might be the culprit. Bananas are great, especially with peanut butter! I quit early and had 3 Margaritas and some Mexican food from "On The Border". The arm-pump is all but GONE!!!!
LOL!!
Regards
The arm-pump was more prevalent than ever, but having been off for 3 months with a broken arm might be the culprit. Bananas are great, especially with peanut butter! I quit early and had 3 Margaritas and some Mexican food from "On The Border". The arm-pump is all but GONE!!!!
LOL!!
Regards
- Apr 11, 2001
- 558
- 0
If I remember correctly, Niacin will expand your arteries, increasing the blood flow. Helps when you're weightlifting and using supplements.
PWDAD,
Since "arm pump" is a catch all term for various degrees of forearm fatigue ranging from weakening grip to severe "rigor" like cramping of the hand, the causes are likely variable. Electrolyte imbalance has long been implemented as the culprit and probably is for some of the cases. Depletion of immediate energy sources is also a likely candidate as well as the acidic byproducts of muscle contraction disabling release of ions needed for contraction.
So where do you fit in the puzzle:
If you get cramps or arm pump fairly quickly during a race and they do not go away than I would focus on training. This is to separate out the high anxiety "death grip" that we all have likely experienced early in a race that subsides on its own after we relax. The energy that supplies the muscle is actually needed to unattached the "bridges" that form to shorten muscle. Therefore, no energy available, the muscle is kind of "locked" into a contraction (rigor mortis like) although you are hopefully still living. Wrist curls, wrist rolls (my favorite), squeeze balls or grips, throw away wrist wraps if you use them to lift and of course, lots of saddle time pushing into arm pump. Training will in effect increase the availability and efficient use of energy sources, thus delaying the onset of cramping and fatigue.
Electrolyte imbalance will usually rear its head later in a race especially in an enduro or harescramble, although if you are imbalanced before the race it could come earlier. I can not stress enough the importance of prehydrating and rehydrating with a sports drink or supplement that has the basic electrolytes: Potassium, magnesium, sodium etc.. If you preload days before a race with strictly water and likewise on race day you are actually leaching electrolytes out of your body (remember osmosis). If you favor water, get the electrolytes through food intake. This will set you up for early onset of fatigue and if it is hot and you sweat a lot it could be much worse since additional electrolytes are lost in sweat. Low sodium with heat and heavy exertion can be deadly, I have seen this first hand at marathons. Although not an absolute, muscle cramping from electrolyte imbalance usually feels like a failing grip and not as much locking of the hand.
Good old fashion muscle fatigue is usually caused by a decrease in the availability of calcium needed for a contraction. This is not a systemic problem as all the calcium supplement in the world wouldn't help. It is there it just can't get where it needs to be because of the byproducts of contraction impede its release. This can also be impacted by training.
By know means are these phenomena mutually exclusive and could easily occur together. There really is no substitute for additional training and riding as they are the key and will impact on the causes as you will become more efficient in storing and extracting energy from the muscle as well as buffering byproducts and utilizing electrolytes.
BTW, this topic has been debated by exercise physiologists for years and there still is no consensus, this includes my office :) This is likely due to the multiple factors at work and dumb co-workers :D, nothing is simple! I don't mean to knock on anyones ideas and I say if they work, than go for it.
We didn't even mentione ergos on the bike: bar-setup, grips, stabilizer, rider positon etc..
Good Luck, Keith
Since "arm pump" is a catch all term for various degrees of forearm fatigue ranging from weakening grip to severe "rigor" like cramping of the hand, the causes are likely variable. Electrolyte imbalance has long been implemented as the culprit and probably is for some of the cases. Depletion of immediate energy sources is also a likely candidate as well as the acidic byproducts of muscle contraction disabling release of ions needed for contraction.
So where do you fit in the puzzle:
If you get cramps or arm pump fairly quickly during a race and they do not go away than I would focus on training. This is to separate out the high anxiety "death grip" that we all have likely experienced early in a race that subsides on its own after we relax. The energy that supplies the muscle is actually needed to unattached the "bridges" that form to shorten muscle. Therefore, no energy available, the muscle is kind of "locked" into a contraction (rigor mortis like) although you are hopefully still living. Wrist curls, wrist rolls (my favorite), squeeze balls or grips, throw away wrist wraps if you use them to lift and of course, lots of saddle time pushing into arm pump. Training will in effect increase the availability and efficient use of energy sources, thus delaying the onset of cramping and fatigue.
Electrolyte imbalance will usually rear its head later in a race especially in an enduro or harescramble, although if you are imbalanced before the race it could come earlier. I can not stress enough the importance of prehydrating and rehydrating with a sports drink or supplement that has the basic electrolytes: Potassium, magnesium, sodium etc.. If you preload days before a race with strictly water and likewise on race day you are actually leaching electrolytes out of your body (remember osmosis). If you favor water, get the electrolytes through food intake. This will set you up for early onset of fatigue and if it is hot and you sweat a lot it could be much worse since additional electrolytes are lost in sweat. Low sodium with heat and heavy exertion can be deadly, I have seen this first hand at marathons. Although not an absolute, muscle cramping from electrolyte imbalance usually feels like a failing grip and not as much locking of the hand.
Good old fashion muscle fatigue is usually caused by a decrease in the availability of calcium needed for a contraction. This is not a systemic problem as all the calcium supplement in the world wouldn't help. It is there it just can't get where it needs to be because of the byproducts of contraction impede its release. This can also be impacted by training.
By know means are these phenomena mutually exclusive and could easily occur together. There really is no substitute for additional training and riding as they are the key and will impact on the causes as you will become more efficient in storing and extracting energy from the muscle as well as buffering byproducts and utilizing electrolytes.
BTW, this topic has been debated by exercise physiologists for years and there still is no consensus, this includes my office :) This is likely due to the multiple factors at work and dumb co-workers :D, nothing is simple! I don't mean to knock on anyones ideas and I say if they work, than go for it.
We didn't even mentione ergos on the bike: bar-setup, grips, stabilizer, rider positon etc..
Good Luck, Keith
Last edited:
- Thread starter
- #10
Where I fit:
Thank you all for info.
Keith:
My problem has been related to practice time on the track, the mtot's I run are mostly so short that as I am getting the feeling the race is ending.
As far as the practice goes. I will get out on the track, warm up a little and ride the track nice and slow to examine the line and track condition. Then I will stop think about how I want to ride the track and begin to push.
By about the third lap approx 1 mile track, my arms will begin to tighten up to the point where I am concerned about my grip and the clutch pull is nearly impossible.
They arm will tighten and swell some so that the big muscle on the buttom side of the forarm will feel like a rock.
I pull of the track and in a couple of minutes the feeling will subside and I can get back on the track for a couple more laps before it happens again. It really never goes away throughout the day on the track, coupel laps take a break, couple laps take a break.
My forarms are actully in pretty decent shape, but I do have a decent amount muscle mass 5-11" 225lbs. I wakeboard when I am not riding which helps my arms stayin decent sahpe, and they dot really fatigue in other sporting functions.
I am also looking into having my suspension hoping that a dialed in suspension will allow me to reduce my grip a bit and relax my arms, just a thought. If I am not fighting the bike as mush maybe this will make me more relaxed.
What is your thoughts on the condition, training, supplements (drinks pills etc),
My darn kid (Loretta's 2001) can practice on the track all day 50+ hard laps no fatigue, no pain etc, I ride 3 and I feel like my forarms are going to blow up, damn old age.
PWDAD
Thank you all for info.
Keith:
My problem has been related to practice time on the track, the mtot's I run are mostly so short that as I am getting the feeling the race is ending.
As far as the practice goes. I will get out on the track, warm up a little and ride the track nice and slow to examine the line and track condition. Then I will stop think about how I want to ride the track and begin to push.
By about the third lap approx 1 mile track, my arms will begin to tighten up to the point where I am concerned about my grip and the clutch pull is nearly impossible.
They arm will tighten and swell some so that the big muscle on the buttom side of the forarm will feel like a rock.
I pull of the track and in a couple of minutes the feeling will subside and I can get back on the track for a couple more laps before it happens again. It really never goes away throughout the day on the track, coupel laps take a break, couple laps take a break.
My forarms are actully in pretty decent shape, but I do have a decent amount muscle mass 5-11" 225lbs. I wakeboard when I am not riding which helps my arms stayin decent sahpe, and they dot really fatigue in other sporting functions.
I am also looking into having my suspension hoping that a dialed in suspension will allow me to reduce my grip a bit and relax my arms, just a thought. If I am not fighting the bike as mush maybe this will make me more relaxed.
What is your thoughts on the condition, training, supplements (drinks pills etc),
My darn kid (Loretta's 2001) can practice on the track all day 50+ hard laps no fatigue, no pain etc, I ride 3 and I feel like my forarms are going to blow up, damn old age.
PWDAD
DKT735
Sponsoring Member
- Mar 16, 2000
- 118
- 0
Forearm and wrist exercises
I used to get arm pump and hand cramps until I started doing wrist and forearem exercises.
There are a number of exercises that you can do but I found a item called a Grip Stik that I like to use. Their web site is www.gripstik.com.
Good luck
I used to get arm pump and hand cramps until I started doing wrist and forearem exercises.
There are a number of exercises that you can do but I found a item called a Grip Stik that I like to use. Their web site is www.gripstik.com.
Good luck
PWDAD,
Some physics: Whether it is muscle or else at 225 and 5' 11", you have a lot of mass to contend with. Keep in mind, I am an average B rider, but I think riding style/position could also play a role in fatigue. Basically you have 2 links to your bike: hands and feet (inner thigh could count as three). You are constantly fighting the acceleration of the bike to keep weight forward. If you do not stand with legs relatively straight and leaning forward you now have added an additional force to overcome your body weight. I notice this on whoops the most, as I used to stand in a partial squat and lean back with arms extended and my forearms would cook in short work. I was literally hanging on. Watching faster riders, I saw their aggressive style and that their center of mass was in front of the foot pegs and elbows are bent, their head is almost over the bars. Get somone to watch you ride and see where your head lines up. Make sense that this would require less grip force. It also decreases the impulse force, that is how quickly the force is applied, because the arms, namely the biceps, can spread out the acceleration force over period of time thus the impulse is less at the hand. Sounds easy but it is not as this style of riding requires lots of leg strength/endurance and a could degree of courage. I think Ryan Hughes does this well.
Your bike set-up could play a role: For example having an appropriate bar mount for your height/arm length is critical. At 6'2" the difference for a forward and raised bar mount on my YZ400 was tremendous in my ability to stand comfortably with getting my weight forward. Suspension could arguably influence as well, rebound could influence acceleration force on whoops or too much rear sag or to little compression could effect the attitude of the bike causing a shift of body weight to the rear. I am sure the suspension experts, which I am not, could make a case for many mods that would assist in fatigue reduction. The basic premise is if the bike's suspension takes the hit your body does not as less force is transferred to you.
To me your description sounds like good old muscle fatigue and not an electrolyte imbalance. With caution, I would try to push into the arm pump a little bit to load the muscle when riding and maybe try to take progressively shorter rest breaks. I would try a routine of wrist curls, wrist rolls and grip exercises and see if it helps. I know they have been outlined on this forum as this is a common thread. I can tell you one day a week of riding will likely not cut it without supplementing something, either ride more of work out more. Keep in mind muscle adaptations take weeks not days, although some improvement and fatigue resistance could be quicker.
I have nothing against supplements, but I do have a problem with certain manufactoror's claims of their unproven mechanism of action and effect. If you give a specific name, I will gladly offer an opinion that reflects my interpretation of current available literature. Although I am guilty of taking some supplements that have no research support at all!
Got to run, long drive for turkey day awaits!
Happy Thanksgiving, Keith
Some physics: Whether it is muscle or else at 225 and 5' 11", you have a lot of mass to contend with. Keep in mind, I am an average B rider, but I think riding style/position could also play a role in fatigue. Basically you have 2 links to your bike: hands and feet (inner thigh could count as three). You are constantly fighting the acceleration of the bike to keep weight forward. If you do not stand with legs relatively straight and leaning forward you now have added an additional force to overcome your body weight. I notice this on whoops the most, as I used to stand in a partial squat and lean back with arms extended and my forearms would cook in short work. I was literally hanging on. Watching faster riders, I saw their aggressive style and that their center of mass was in front of the foot pegs and elbows are bent, their head is almost over the bars. Get somone to watch you ride and see where your head lines up. Make sense that this would require less grip force. It also decreases the impulse force, that is how quickly the force is applied, because the arms, namely the biceps, can spread out the acceleration force over period of time thus the impulse is less at the hand. Sounds easy but it is not as this style of riding requires lots of leg strength/endurance and a could degree of courage. I think Ryan Hughes does this well.
Your bike set-up could play a role: For example having an appropriate bar mount for your height/arm length is critical. At 6'2" the difference for a forward and raised bar mount on my YZ400 was tremendous in my ability to stand comfortably with getting my weight forward. Suspension could arguably influence as well, rebound could influence acceleration force on whoops or too much rear sag or to little compression could effect the attitude of the bike causing a shift of body weight to the rear. I am sure the suspension experts, which I am not, could make a case for many mods that would assist in fatigue reduction. The basic premise is if the bike's suspension takes the hit your body does not as less force is transferred to you.
To me your description sounds like good old muscle fatigue and not an electrolyte imbalance. With caution, I would try to push into the arm pump a little bit to load the muscle when riding and maybe try to take progressively shorter rest breaks. I would try a routine of wrist curls, wrist rolls and grip exercises and see if it helps. I know they have been outlined on this forum as this is a common thread. I can tell you one day a week of riding will likely not cut it without supplementing something, either ride more of work out more. Keep in mind muscle adaptations take weeks not days, although some improvement and fatigue resistance could be quicker.
I have nothing against supplements, but I do have a problem with certain manufactoror's claims of their unproven mechanism of action and effect. If you give a specific name, I will gladly offer an opinion that reflects my interpretation of current available literature. Although I am guilty of taking some supplements that have no research support at all!
Got to run, long drive for turkey day awaits!
Happy Thanksgiving, Keith
- Thread starter
- #13
Thanks to Keith and all who posted:
Happy Thanksgiving to all
Keith:
When Thanksgiving is over can you please give me an e-mail, I would to talk a little more about MX conditioning and products.
[email protected]
Thanks,
PWDAD
Happy Thanksgiving to all
Keith:
When Thanksgiving is over can you please give me an e-mail, I would to talk a little more about MX conditioning and products.
[email protected]
Thanks,
PWDAD
