i am getting back into riding after a 5year break. i am looking at getting a bike for trails 99% of the time with an mx track (informal riding with friends only not a race) maybe once or twice a year. i grew up on a '92 RM 125 however, i do not want that kind of on/off pipe power. i have been looking at several 4strokes and the KDX 200. just recently a friend was talking about the smooth power of a 300exc. that is exactly what i am looking for, SMOOTH POWER. i know the quality of the KTMs and after reading some the posts it seems that the 200, 250, and 300EXCs are smooth. which one would be the smoothest from the top to the bottom. which one would be the most rider friendly for a person just getting back into riding? are all three engines reliable (i want to be riding not wrenching so i mean KDX reliable or are they more like maintaining my old mx bike)? i will be buying either a new leftover '04 or a new '05 so i can control the break-in and maintainance but i don't want to pay the price for one of the EXC RFSs. i live in washington state and we have everything for terrain including mountains, big hill climbs, sand, tight timbered single tracks, wide open fire roads, mud, snow ect. ect. i am 5'7" tall 180lbs and very athletic. when i was riding 5years ago i would have considered myself an intermidiate rider but it has been a while.
Which Bike? 200, 250, 300exc
- Thread starter gjbruny
- Start date
Dave.Smith
Member
- Dec 15, 2002
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The 200 is a distinctly different bike than the other two. It is based, both engine and frame, on the 125. The engine is very much like a 250 four stroke - more torque accross the powerband than a 125, but about the same top end power. The result is a lighter bike that needs to be revved a bit.
The 250/300 share the same engine and frame. The 300 pulls harder from the bottom and has more linear power delivery than the 250. The 300s are more tiring to ride if you don't execise some throttle control.
They are all great bikes for the woods.
The 250/300 share the same engine and frame. The 300 pulls harder from the bottom and has more linear power delivery than the 250. The 300s are more tiring to ride if you don't execise some throttle control.
They are all great bikes for the woods.
Hurricane901
~SPONSOR~
- Aug 24, 2001
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Go 300, best of both worlds.
euro gasgas
Sponsoring Member
- Sep 18, 2001
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Smoothest power - GasGas EC300. I'll post a dyno curve, straight line. no dips, yanks, hits.
A friend of mine rode mine and refers to it as a "300cc electric drill".
- jeff
A friend of mine rode mine and refers to it as a "300cc electric drill".
- jeff
- Thread starter
- #7
250 Exc power?
our ktm dealer has left-over 250EXCs from 03 and 04. is there any significant difference between the two? also what are the power characteristics like? is it SMOOTH similar to the 300exc (just with less power) or is there a hit within the powerband? are there any flat spots or does it pull from the bottom to the top? is it luggable or is it happier @ higher revs?
our ktm dealer has left-over 250EXCs from 03 and 04. is there any significant difference between the two? also what are the power characteristics like? is it SMOOTH similar to the 300exc (just with less power) or is there a hit within the powerband? are there any flat spots or does it pull from the bottom to the top? is it luggable or is it happier @ higher revs?
CR Swade
~SPONSOR~
- Jan 18, 2001
- 1,764
- 5
The 04 and 05's are a much smoother engine. The 05 in particular has a re-designed CDI w/ even smoother power characteristics...about the best I have found for woods work. The 04 and 05 are very lean and need some jetting help, no big deal as it is a pilot jet and a JD kit from right. The only other mod is to go w/ the EE pipe, the stocker is soft and holds the bike back in terms of pull. Normally I am not a "run this pipe" person, but on the KTM the pipe does help pretty dramatically. Eliminating the stock spark arrestor will help also, plus shed quite a bit of weight. Add a couple of teeth on the rear sprocket and she is ready for battle.
They also went to a 36mm carb in 04; I questioned whether I would want to up to the 38 (like the 03) initially, but after spending much time on the bike, the 36 seems fine. It gives good response, but still pulls nice on top (top speed in the low 80's). The engine will tractor at zero revs or rev out hard. Not too frantic like the 200, and a little zingier than the 300...yeah its my favorite.
The 03 defintely is more muscular, one of the strongest, if not the strongest 250EXC engine produced. This can be good and bad, if you are running really tight, technical woods...go for the smoother power of the 04/05's. Lastly, the engine was redesigned in 04 to be roughly 8lbs lighter...the 04/05's are very light.
Lastly, the suspension upgrades in both 04 and even more so in 05 (suspension and frame) are worth going w/ the newer bikes.
They also went to a 36mm carb in 04; I questioned whether I would want to up to the 38 (like the 03) initially, but after spending much time on the bike, the 36 seems fine. It gives good response, but still pulls nice on top (top speed in the low 80's). The engine will tractor at zero revs or rev out hard. Not too frantic like the 200, and a little zingier than the 300...yeah its my favorite.
The 03 defintely is more muscular, one of the strongest, if not the strongest 250EXC engine produced. This can be good and bad, if you are running really tight, technical woods...go for the smoother power of the 04/05's. Lastly, the engine was redesigned in 04 to be roughly 8lbs lighter...the 04/05's are very light.
Lastly, the suspension upgrades in both 04 and even more so in 05 (suspension and frame) are worth going w/ the newer bikes.
euro gasgas
Sponsoring Member
- Sep 18, 2001
- 287
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gjbruny said:
I chose it because it was easy to ride, had top quality suspension components and was "efficient" like my old XR250R. It puts all the power to the ground likea four stroke and isn't tiring to ride. It was easy for me to adapt from riding 4 strokes to this bike - you can lug it around like a four stroke or scream it around if you want to get your yas-yas out.
As far as parts go - there are several places doing mail order; I was paranoid at first - ordered spare shift lever, levers, etc.; Now I don't worry about it at all. The gasgas 300 is pretty bulletproof. Check out www.smackovermotorsports.com - their is a forum where any question you have will usually be answered in an hour or less (by one of the guys who love these bikes).
I know there is a shop in Boise & Wenatchee - both of those places would get things to you overnight via UPS ground...
There are still a few new '04s left around at very good prices. You might want to look at one used - better price and many are "senior" owned and well maintained.
- jeff
Having just picked up my 300 MXC, I only have about 12 hours on it but I would say for the discount due to the lack of a light, and speed it is defiantly worth it. The comment above about it being like an electric motor is spot on. I was out 3 weeks ago with a yz426, and a cr125, and rm125 with the hz being the oldest bike. In the tight muddy stuff the 125sa were nowhere to be seen and in the wide open I was able to pull on the 426. We are all about the same skill level and coming off of a 95 rm250 setup for trails this bike is unbelievable. I would reccomend the 300.
Me and the two buddies all have '05 KTM's, a 200, 250, and 300. I'm on the 3. I raced a '05 250exc in Poland for 6 days last fall.....
For you, best bike would be the 250, IMHO....
The '05 suspension is better. I had an '03 250exc. Engine was disappointing.... I like the small carbs on the 250/300. They jet better.
For you, best bike would be the 250, IMHO....
The '05 suspension is better. I had an '03 250exc. Engine was disappointing.... I like the small carbs on the 250/300. They jet better.
- Thread starter
- #13
Buckholz said:
i just test rode an '04 200exc today. it had a fairly hard it in the mid-range similar to my old mx bikes (i don't want that in a trail bike). does the 250 have this same hit or is the power linear like the 300? i have the chance to buy a leftover '04 250exc for 4950.00 out the door.
Jonesy920x
Member
- Mar 2, 2005
- 2
- 0
MXC vs EXC
What is the difference between the 300 MXC and EXC. I know about the gear box and lack of light, but what about functionality ? I sold my 04 WR 450 and I am back in the market. I can't make up my mind about going with the 450 or the 300. The WR ripped ( after hours of jetting work and uncorking). However it was a frign' TANK. I loved the E-start of the 4 stroke. I am really leaning towards the 2 stroke 300, but they are getting really pricey.
What is the difference between the 300 MXC and EXC. I know about the gear box and lack of light, but what about functionality ? I sold my 04 WR 450 and I am back in the market. I can't make up my mind about going with the 450 or the 300. The WR ripped ( after hours of jetting work and uncorking). However it was a frign' TANK. I loved the E-start of the 4 stroke. I am really leaning towards the 2 stroke 300, but they are getting really pricey.
shazam_339
Member
- Jan 22, 2003
- 2
- 0
I ride a 1998 ktm 200 exc and even though it may be not new, it is still an awesome bike in the woods. i think if you got it than you wood be really happy with the weight and the handling. it has plenty of power for anything except drag racing the others. i let a friend ride it and he has a yamaha wr450 and now he wants a 2 stroke ktm! :ride:
I ride an 04 400exc and an 04 200exc. The 200 might be one of the best tight woods machines ever made. Put a 9oz. flywheel weight on it and go.
If you can only have one bike and want a 2 stroke get the 300exc. Smooth linear power but will really rip when you push it.
If you can only have one bike and want a 2 stroke get the 300exc. Smooth linear power but will really rip when you push it.
SteveG_northwest
Member
- Jul 12, 2004
- 8
- 0
I can vouch for the 300
I've got a 2003 300 EX/C and couldn't be happier (except for the hard seat!). I owned a KDX 200 for a couple of years and then a KX 250 for a couple after that, so I know what you mean about wanting smooth power. BTW, I also live in Washington state-- I do most of my warm season riding in Little Naches area.
The 300 reminds me of the KDX but with a lot more power (which is the only thing I wanted more of with my KDX). It has more power than my KX 250, but it so smooth and user friendly. I was debating getting a 4 stroke but am glad I didn't get it-- the 300 has great luggable low-end power that will rival a 4 stroke power, is much lighter that a 4 stroke, and flat out gets with the program when you want it to (Dirt rider magazine jokingly referred to it as a "3 stroke" in this month's 300 vs 400 exc article due to its smooth grunty power). I found it MUCH less tiring to ride than my KX 250, even though I added a flywheel weight to smooth it out. I find myself going much faster, for longer, on the 300 without really even trying. The 300 goes slow and crawls up things when you need, It makes going fast easy, makes technicall/hilly easy, etc. (Check out the dirt rider magazine website for articles). I would have been happy with a 250 EX/C too (they both were 2-stroke off road bike of the year), but with power that's this smooth and usable, why not have more? You can always not twist as much!
Oh yeah, you can also find several articles that talk about how long 300 EX/C top ends last-- A long time!
I've got a 2003 300 EX/C and couldn't be happier (except for the hard seat!). I owned a KDX 200 for a couple of years and then a KX 250 for a couple after that, so I know what you mean about wanting smooth power. BTW, I also live in Washington state-- I do most of my warm season riding in Little Naches area.
The 300 reminds me of the KDX but with a lot more power (which is the only thing I wanted more of with my KDX). It has more power than my KX 250, but it so smooth and user friendly. I was debating getting a 4 stroke but am glad I didn't get it-- the 300 has great luggable low-end power that will rival a 4 stroke power, is much lighter that a 4 stroke, and flat out gets with the program when you want it to (Dirt rider magazine jokingly referred to it as a "3 stroke" in this month's 300 vs 400 exc article due to its smooth grunty power). I found it MUCH less tiring to ride than my KX 250, even though I added a flywheel weight to smooth it out. I find myself going much faster, for longer, on the 300 without really even trying. The 300 goes slow and crawls up things when you need, It makes going fast easy, makes technicall/hilly easy, etc. (Check out the dirt rider magazine website for articles). I would have been happy with a 250 EX/C too (they both were 2-stroke off road bike of the year), but with power that's this smooth and usable, why not have more? You can always not twist as much!
Oh yeah, you can also find several articles that talk about how long 300 EX/C top ends last-- A long time!
G'day I have had an 04 250 exc then rode a mates 05 300, only breifly but it was enough to convince me to get a 300 exc. I now have an 06 300 exc and it's much better than the 250 apparently the motor is exactly the same as in 05. I remember reading magazine reviews about the 300 being a handful if your not careful with your right hand, but I disagree, it is much eaier to ride than the 250 no more top end just more bottom end making it more linear and it's amazing how much it will hang on in the lower revs. If you want four stroke power put the optional stiffer power valve spring in (takes about 3 minutes, I carry the optional springs in my bum bag and change to the stiffer one in slippery conditions). If you want some serious power than put the lighter springer in (there are 3 different springs to choose from) but you'll want some decent traction or you'll be wheel spinning more than anything else. Maintanence wise, I change the gearbox oil every 10 hours, and I've got 73 hours on the motor and it's still going hard, won't be rebuilding it any time soon. But I've noticed some oil aroung the counter shaft sprocket, my 250 required a new seal there too in the year and a half I owned it.
SpeedyManiac
Member
- Aug 8, 2000
- 2,374
- 0
I have a GasGas EC200 and it is really smooth. It has been great on the trails around the Kootenays which are very tight and technical. Parts have not been a problem either.
- Nov 3, 2004
- 170
- 0
GJ,
You have a lot of advice now. However, you did not mention if you plan on racing and if so what type....hare scramble or enduro. If you are a casual trail rider the 300 or 250 are good choices. If you want to race competively, go with the 200. The reason is weight. Although all 3 bikes are within 10 pounds, the crank inertia increases as the displacement increases. This will tire you and make you commit more mistakes. MX power bands also wear you out on long rides and races. You have to judge for yourself what your skill and fitness level are. Most guys don't like smallbores since they feel that clutching and shifting requires too much effort. I don't like picking up heavy bikes, having massive amounts of torque rip my arms, and trying to manhandle an extra 10 pounds through tight event trail. I am sure you are more confused now than when this started. Good luck....
You have a lot of advice now. However, you did not mention if you plan on racing and if so what type....hare scramble or enduro. If you are a casual trail rider the 300 or 250 are good choices. If you want to race competively, go with the 200. The reason is weight. Although all 3 bikes are within 10 pounds, the crank inertia increases as the displacement increases. This will tire you and make you commit more mistakes. MX power bands also wear you out on long rides and races. You have to judge for yourself what your skill and fitness level are. Most guys don't like smallbores since they feel that clutching and shifting requires too much effort. I don't like picking up heavy bikes, having massive amounts of torque rip my arms, and trying to manhandle an extra 10 pounds through tight event trail. I am sure you are more confused now than when this started. Good luck....
I dont think there is a bad choice to make among those 3 bikes. I have had two 300s, and now a 05 250 (thanks to Fred T letting me ride his!) - and a 03 200 followed me home just the other day (for my son..really...not for me.... ;) )
It dont matter what I ride, I am slow compared to most of these guys...so for me it is about how much I can enjoy the ride. I absolutely loved the grunt and giggle factor of the 300 when trail riding...you could hardly ever be in the wrong gear! A real blast to ride. But I found that when I tried to push the pace, or rider longer rides or race enduros, it was tiring - like trashrider said - all that torque tuggin at ya wears you out. Keep in mind, I am a outta shape desk jockey though, so if you are athletic - this may not be an issue at all - plus I understand the 04 and newer 300s are a bit less of a hit motor than what my 00 was.
At first I was disappointed with my 250 - i missed that giggle factor motor -then I discovered I was riding a faster pace, and was LESS tired. The real proof hit me at the Jackpine this year - Fred T shouts out to me "Last Check - you're done!" I was really disappointed and wanted to ride some more! (shoulda done that A section after that!) Now I absolutely LOVE that 250.
I have not ridden the 200 yet - but it will be an interesting comparison for me - I do suspect I will have a hard time adjusting to the power delivery - but who knows - maybe I will try an enduro on it (gotta legalize it first though).
It dont matter what I ride, I am slow compared to most of these guys...so for me it is about how much I can enjoy the ride. I absolutely loved the grunt and giggle factor of the 300 when trail riding...you could hardly ever be in the wrong gear! A real blast to ride. But I found that when I tried to push the pace, or rider longer rides or race enduros, it was tiring - like trashrider said - all that torque tuggin at ya wears you out. Keep in mind, I am a outta shape desk jockey though, so if you are athletic - this may not be an issue at all - plus I understand the 04 and newer 300s are a bit less of a hit motor than what my 00 was.
At first I was disappointed with my 250 - i missed that giggle factor motor -then I discovered I was riding a faster pace, and was LESS tired. The real proof hit me at the Jackpine this year - Fred T shouts out to me "Last Check - you're done!" I was really disappointed and wanted to ride some more! (shoulda done that A section after that!) Now I absolutely LOVE that 250.
I have not ridden the 200 yet - but it will be an interesting comparison for me - I do suspect I will have a hard time adjusting to the power delivery - but who knows - maybe I will try an enduro on it (gotta legalize it first though).
- Nov 28, 2004
- 413
- 1
USE CAUTION on the 200 Mike as they are very addicting and after 1 ride you will be buying another bike :boss:
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