elcamino12sec
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- Jan 16, 2006
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rmc_olderthandirt said:California already imposes some major restrictions on dirt bikes that don't meet the EPA guidelines, which none of the two strokes do.
Chili said:Can't say that I'm currently up to date on the Green/Red sticker regulations but how many of the new 4 stroke MX bikes meet those EPA guidelines and qualify for a green sticker?
kawicam250 said:not many, but a lot more 4T's are gettin green stickers than 2T's, thats for sure.
rmc_olderthandirt said:I do a lot of boating as well as dirt biking. I am well aware of the two stroke issue on outboards. The sale of new two stroke outboards have been banned in California for years and it has now spread nation wide. Two stroke PWCs are banned from many areas.
The push to erradicate two strokes in general is strong and gaining strength. California already imposes some major restrictions on dirt bikes that don't meet the EPA guidelines, which none of the two strokes do. In California, a two stroke bike from years 2003 on are banned from MANY riding areas for a majority of the year.
So far, weed trimmers and leaf blowers have escaped the ban only because of the hue and cry from all the gardeners. The tide is rising, however, and you can only shovel sand against the tide for so long.
The direct injection two stroke systems have potential, but they don't totally solve the problem because there is still oil getting into the combustion chamber which doesn't burn completely. The direct injection systems still need more development as the existing models have proven to be very unreliable.
Rod
I wouldnt call quoting the BRP website posting "facts". BRP loves to stretch the truth when it comes to emissions and fuel economy on their FI 2-strokes.Rhein said:Please people share common courtesy and post relevant and recent FACTS, not opinions, if you are trying to make an argument.
Thanks!
I dont think that any of the MX 4-strokes made after '05 qualify for green sticker.Chili said:Can't say that I'm currently up to date on the Green/Red sticker regulations but how many of the new 4 stroke MX bikes meet those EPA guidelines and qualify for a green sticker?
2 strokes for life said:HubertGarfunkleIII, i figure 5 or so years befor the new fule injected 2 strokes come out.
Octane250F said:I wouldnt call quoting the BRP website posting "facts". BRP loves to stretch the truth when it comes to emissions and fuel economy on their FI 2-strokes.
I can recall BRP's infamous "2 > 4" snowmobile ad campaign that was full of half truths and outright lies.
There is no way that no unburnt fuel escapes because a 2-stroke never really completely seals the exhaust port. All that the E-Tec technology does is spray the fuel directly into the crankcase and times the release of the fuel charge into the engine much more precisely than carbs ever could.
I should also mention that FI 2-strokes use iginition timing that uses an array of sensors to adjust the ignition timing to keep the engine on a verge of siezing at all times (and thats when a 2-stroke runs its best). Its cool technology, but 2-stroke dirtbikes are known for short life already, so just how long do you think an FI 2-stroke dirtbike motor (that runs super lean all the time) is going to last? I would bet not long.
Chili said:Can't say that I'm currently up to date on the Green/Red sticker regulations but how many of the new 4 stroke MX bikes meet those EPA guidelines and qualify for a green sticker?
Octane250F said:Thats not what I meant. I meant they lie when they compare emissions between their 2-strokes and 4-stroke. I never said anything about emissions certifications, of course they cant lie about that.
Im sorry, but there is no engine that burns every last drop of fuel. Also, there is no way a 2-stroke can completely seal the exhaust port because the piston and rings dont give you a perfect seal.
If you know anything about engines, Im sure you realize that the piston slaps back and forth as it moves up and down in the cylinder and you are bound to get leaks.
I wont deny that FI 2-strokes are very clean, much cleaner than carbed 2-strokes, but you arguements are flawed and your claims are just downright untrue.
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