2003 KX65 keeps seizing, need help.

[John Blaze]

All right, I bought my younger brother a 2003 KX65. Brand new. Now, after riding through the first tank of gas I did the normal maintainence on it. Air filter, trans fluid, new plug, greased all bearings, etc. Then through the second tank of gas the bike seizes badly while he's not even riding it hard. So I'm disappointed greatly since the Kawasaki dealer I bought it from won't even give me a 10% discount on the parts I need to fix the bike that I just bought from them the day before for $3000 cash.

So I buy the parts and fix the bike that night. Bike starts up perfectly, I break it in easilly and it runs perfectly. Next day, brother goes out and we put a tank of gas through it. It ran perfect, never got to hot or anything. We go out the next day and again, the bike seizes exactly like the time before. He's not riding it hard when it happens it just goes.

Also, on each of the seizes the engine is tore up pretty bad. Worse than I've seen any engines go in a while. I'm talking, completly new cylinder, piston, head, crank and rod is gone. Their's no honing or sanding possible, it's just blown up.

Now Kawasaki will give me no satisfaction with this defective bike and I'm considering taking legal action since this is just terrible.

I can't afford to pay for an entire new engine again, mainly because I am Enlisted in the armed forces and obviously, do not make a lot of money. Can anyone point me in the right direction to talk to at Kawasaki? Am I dreaming that they will help me?

If so, where can I get cheaper parts to repair this bike? Websites? Is their somewhere that sells complete engines? Since thats pretty much what I need.

Much thanks to anyone who can help at all.
John Campbell
PV2 US Army

 

[gwcrim]

I'd raise he11 like no one ever could imagine. Start a letter writing campaing and send one to every Kawasaki person you can possibly imagine. Explain that if you don't get another NEW bike the next letter they get will be from an attorney.

 

[nephron]

What premix, ratio, pilot and airscrew settings?
Any possibility of a lean vacuum leak downside of the carb?
Lastly, you should send the entire motor to Gorr and have him look at it. He may be able to identify a factory problem, such as casting slag @ a port edge (used to occur fairly often with the electrofusion plating--not sure if they changed to the new chrome alloy plating on the 65 or not). That last step is of utmost importance, and where my suspicion would ly first, since these seizures sounded like they were occuring on warmup.

What are your jetting specs, altitude and temp?

Also, find out if there are any Kawasaki service bulletins on this. I can ask my dealer if need be, since yours may not end up wanting to be honest.

 

[rickyd]

I'm interested in this thread, we have a 03 KX65.. RUn it at 32:1 redline oil, stock jetting, not sure what the screw is set too.. I've read in the past on here that it is a good idea too run them at 32:1, the crank likes alot of oil, if that helps you.. Good luck, keep us posted..
Rick

 

[nephron]

Hmmm...no response since the 16th.

No mention of premix in the first post.

Occum's razor?

 

[John Blaze]

Thank you all for the responses. If you're all wondering why I havent responded sooner, I'm currently in Korea and have little time to come on the internet.

Answers to your guy's questions:

I ran it with Honda HP2 Racing 2 cycle oil @ 32:1. Same oil I have used for years in all of my CR's including my AF.

I'll have to call home to get the jetting specs for you since I do not remember them off hand. I do know the bike was running on the rich side, not overly rich to cause fouling but rich enough that I thought was safe. I've yet to blow up any engine by running it to rich, so if this was the cause, it's new to me.

I haven't checked for a vacuum leak on the carb, but since I completely disasembled the entire engine/carb and reassembled it myself for the second run I don't think that was what happened.

Also about a porting slag.. the second try was on a brand new cylinder so I think that should take that out of the list of possible problems.

I would send the engine to Eric if I could afford it. Anyone know how much he would charge for dissasembly and inspection?

I didn't find any bulletins on a recall or anything of the sort on Kawasaki's website, but if anyone comes accross anything please let me know.

I'm thinking the problem lies in either 1) the Cooling system, warter pump or radiator itself or the lines 2) the Ignition system, perhaps it's got a bad ignition map that is advancing the timing too much and causing the detonation?

Thanks again to you all for the help.

 

[MitchPeters]

A bad crank seal maybe, letting air into the crank and leaning it out.

 

[Bultaco206]

I'd check the crank seals. A buddy of mine bought his kid a new '02 KX65 last year and it seized at the kid's first race. Upon teardown, the factory had installed one of the crank seals backwards. Kaw paid up, but it took forever. This is the same guy who bought a new KLX300 for himself this year only to find the factory had not installed an oil filter when he did his first oil change. He's still fighting over that one. Better have a look...

 

[John Blaze]

Having never had a crank seal problem myself, I am unfamiliar with exactly how they destroy an engine.

Perhaps would this be why the bike would run for a certain amount of time before the engine would go? Since on each engine the bike ran fine through 1 tank of gas, then somehwere on the begining of the second tank. It just blows.

I might have to send the engine to Eric Gorr and have him take a look. Thanks guys.

 

[KTM/MAICO]

JB,
Sounds like the motor went after the warm up period, with parts contracting and expanding. I’d be looking at those crank seals like everyone is saying.

What's the status of your dealer? Do they do a lot of volume? Unless you are a Kawasaki certified mechanic and no matter how talented you are with their motors, I wouldn't be holding my breath they will come through for you.

Reading between the lines I get the impression that you might not get along with the employees at your dealership. Did you give them the opportunity to look at the bike and the torn down motor? Did they have any suggestions? Did you follow those suggestions? In most cases, unless they do the work (and often charge a hefty fee) they won’t stand behind it easily stating that you put the motor together incorrectly. If you followed their suggestions then that should be important too.

Contact some of the larger dealerships and see if they have any reports of your same situation. Also, check the mini forum and see what they say on this same topic. These will be the parents of the kids who ride this model bike all the time and should really know what works and what does not. If theirs a real problem, they will know about it. Many also have dealer support and may tell some inside secrets, you never know.

If you want Kawasaki to help you, you probably need to include in any letter writing campaign that you worked with the dealer and didn’t just buy parts only, no matter how skilled you are. This is a common business practice, not just motorcycles. You wouldn’t believe how many people put things together incorrectly and wonder why it doesn’t work.

Yes, they will sell you the parts and why they didn’t give you some kind of discount is ridiculous. Every business has someone they have to answer too, find theirs. Use some of your stateside friends to make some of those calls for you.

Hey, everyone here is on your side because this could have happened to us too. Just wanted to give you a heads up so you have an idea of what’s ahead. Speaking of heads, be careful over there. We all appreciate the work done by the military. If not, we might all be speaking a foreign language.

 

[DEANSFASTWAY]

I saw one ot two 65s that the cases cylinder base (where the cvlinder bolts on) is higher on one side than the other. Maybe the base gasket was weeping a bit. Good Luck

 

[John Blaze]

Just thought I'd update you all..

Kawasaki decided to help us out after the second seizure. Their going to replace everything good as new. They aren't going to give us any money back for the first time it went bad, but this is very good in my book.

After talking to countless representatives at corporate Kawasaki and getting a local racing club to contact them they decided to cover everything.

But now I've got another problem. My brother is afraid to ride the bike and wants a different one. After seizing it twice in a matter of 3 hours of riding and this is first real dirt bike experience I don't blame him.

He wants a XR80 or XR100 since he thinks since they are four strokes they wont have this problem. Now I can sell the KX and get either bike brand new and then maybe some new gear. This might be a good idea, since hell, the KX might just blow up again. But I'd hate to stick someone else in this situation.

Do you guys all think I should stick with the KX or go with a XR? He was riding the KX great, not extremely fast but definatly pretty well. He can touch with both feet while stretching on the KX and he weighs about 92 pounds. I'm afraid the XR wont last him long. I really want him to ride the KX for about a year or two and then get a new CR80 (I'm a Honda guy and it'd look pretty nice next to my AF) and if the KX blows up again I'm just going to give up. Any advice will be appreciated.

Also, thank you very VERY much to everyone who gave advice and helped me out. :)

 

[_j0kA_]

definately go for the xr80/100.. they are absolutely bulletproof and im almost positive if you get a lemon from honda they will do their best to aid in helping you fix it.. i dont like honda, however i have a 2003xr50 and it's a blast.. a lot of my friends brothers have XR80s/100s/200s and they love them..

 

[gwcrim]

That's a tough question. Ask the Kawi reps what they'll do if the engine grenades again. If they say they won't stand behind it anymore, trade it in.

If you choose to buy another bike here's something to keep in mind: At the rate kids grow, make sure that he just barely fits the bike when you get it. Because if you buy one that he can flat foot now, in a year he'll have outgrown it.

 

[tri-mx'er]

If the boy was riding OK on the KX, he is going to be disappointed with the XR, even a 100cc. If Kawasaki finally paid up, I think you have their attention now, if it happens again they will just about have to give you your money back. And if they just repair what siezed like you did, its almost certainly going to sieze again. I have heard of a few of these little bikes having this type of problem (I think the case haves not matching up is probably the culprit), but not quite as bad as yours. I have seen a few burn cranks up, and I think it may be for the same reason. Inform Kawasaki that you are woried about the crank going out, so if it does a month down the line you wont be screwed.
Problems like this really suck. They're great little bikes, but every now and then a bad one comes along. I think you should demand from Kawasaki that they provide you with a warranty on the motor for a time. Either that or a refund. It wouldnt be fair to sell the thing as it is.
Keep us informed,
tri-mx'er