champion vs NGK

[kenney]

i have a 95 cr125. when i bought the bike it had a champion spark plug in it. i ran it untill i could get to the dealer and i got a ngk(BR9EG i believe, what ever the book says) i lost all my midrange power with the NGK. I perfer running the champions because they are cheaper, seem to last longer and i just buy them in a 8 pack and through a new one in evey other ride.I just did a rebuild with a wisco piston kit. do i stay with the champions or try NGK again?
thanks
Bry

 

[Jay-R]

I have had very good luck with the NGK myself, but I run a BR8EG in my CR125. So far I have not fouled a plug and change them every couple of months depending on how much it is ridden. I order them for $3.50 a piece.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[spanky250]

I have used Champion RN3C plugs for years. They work just fine for me.

 

[Jeff Allen]

I find it hard to believe that you "lost all mid range power" from just changing a spark plug brand. Nothing against you but sounds kinda far out to me. I would check to make sure you didn't bump and unplug something when you changed that plug.
Also, if the jetting is right a plug should last a lot longer than every other ride. That’s just throwing money down the drain.

 

[lilcr80]

I too find champion a good plug, I prefer them over NGK. They last longer and I noticed better throttle response. Don't get me wrong NGK is a good plug but why pay so much for one plug.

 

[Mr. Clean]

The only difference in plugs I have experienced was years ago on a poorly jetted RM 400 the Nippondenso u-groove lasted much longer than any other bargain priced plug. Now I buy the cheapest plug I can find and they last me about 6 months. ( usually champion n3c or ngk b8es, I try to avoid "R" or resister plugs because it seems that they foul easier)

Kurt

 

[kenney]

i tried 2 ngk plugs both had the loss of midrange. I was at the track and i could barley make it up the face of the jumps. I got the bike back to my truck and put in a old champion and had no problems jumping at all. The ngk was gapped right too. so i don't think i could have disconected wires between 3 plugs
bry

 

[yardpro]

i swear by the ngk plugs. i have had vety bad experiences with the 'denso's. they foul at the drop of a hat. are the reat ranges on the plugs the same. the plug should not have that much effect on the engine performance.

 

[MikeT]

Originally posted by Kurt Young
I try to avoid "R" or resister plugs because it seems that they foul easier)

Kurt

Ahh, Kurt, from what I have heard, if you run a non resistor plug in a bike that requires it, you might do damage to your electrical system. I would run the "R" plug

 

[biglou]

Go to the NGK website and check out their FAQ's. There are some good questions answered there including the purpose of the "R" type plugs. I posted a link in the recent thread in this forum about midrange rpm's breaking up. I also copy-pasted the question and answer concerning the resistor plugs. I THINK their website is here: www.ngksparkplugs.com but don't hold me to that.

 

[spanky250]

Here are a few links to try for everything you ever wanted to know about spark plugs:

http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/techinfo/spark_plugs/
http://www.nippondenso.com/
http://www.hatraco.com/CHAMPION.HTML

 

[smokeyhaze]

http://www.uti.com/~hoser/Detonation2.htm

 

[yardpro]

wow, lots of hyperlinks. everybody uping thier totals.
kurt. the rsistor is very important in the newer bikes with digital ignition, and especially powerjet carbs. the interference created by the non-r plug can cause problems with these more sensitive systems. If you're having plug fouling problems then almost undoubtedly you're having jetting problems. ( or a weak ignition system. The nonresistors will work better with a weak ignition as they don't require as much potential difference to jump the gap.
but all said i still think denso's are better used as fishing weights.

 

[atc3434`]

I cannot possibly see how its possible that the differnce in a sparkplug could make the differnece between "barely making it up the jump" and hitting the jumps no problem. I simple cannot buy that... its too bogus. A difference between plugs I can believe, but no way there could be that much differnece unless there were serious problems with the NGK.

 

[yardpro]

atc3434`
i agree completely.

 

[awilson40]

possibly....

A 'slightly fouled' plug will give the symptoms he described.
My bike is jetted correctly but is touchy on plugs. When a plug is
marginal I will notice lack of response and bogging in the mid range but will run clean on top.
Replace the plug and performance returns. I tend to believe this is because of a marginal ignition. I have a new coil but it could be a stator or ignition module not firing enough voltage to the coil making it touchy on plugs.
Its not that a different plug gives him better performance, just that the plug he is using is fouled or fouls more easily.

 

[atc3434`]

Yeah, I can deffinatly see that as a possibility, and actually, the likely cause for the symptoms described before. I guess I just wanted to get across that the plug brands themselves couldn't offer such a HUGE difference in performance. I don't think I've ever had the half-fouled plug experience before, I'm interested to see if it'll happen some day on the KDX220R, but then again, I'm doubting it. Didn't foul one all year, even when following friends wife for 10 miles on her TTR125L. She said she never got out of second! Ouch!:mad:

 

[KDX220rm]

I purchase my NGK plugs from either O'Reilly Auto or Advance Auto Parts.

You can get the BR8ES for around 1.19 and the BR8EV for around 3.25.

 

[yardpro]

awilson
how ya doing?
about a week until i'm a dad whoopie:)

if you're touchy on plugs and suspect a weak ignition, go with a nonresistor plug. as you have an older bike with non digital ignition. i doubt that the lack of the resistor would cause a problem. the nonresistor requires less voltage to jump the gap

 

[awilson40]

Hey YardPro....

Big daddy time!!!
You're right... I run Non resistors in mine... just in case.
Pat and I will probably be a J-ville Saturday,thinking about looking at HawBranch, but really like J-ville MX better. I just rebuilt his swimgarm...man, you should have seen it!!! NO Bearings at all...
Just did wear through the race and started eating the aluminum.
Its ready to go now.

 

[yardpro]

glad you cought it in time, but had you not, you could probably do a little fance programing in that cnc machine and whip out some ultracool billet doohicky to fix it.
If you havn't been to haw branch recently you might want to check it out. he had revamped the whole track. also 1/2 moon ( the first place we went) has been redone also. looks like jville is becoming the MX mecca of eastern NC .
Have fun, think about me:ugg:

 

[smooth sail]

I was lucky enough to stumble on a box of old Champion N3-G, gold palladium plugs at a local shop for a buck a piece. I've got enough to last a while. I have used N3-C Champs in the past with no ill effects, and they are 1.19 each at the Farm and Home supply store.
Smooth

P.S. What the heck is Gold Palladium anyway? Maybe a distant relation of Chrome Vanadium?:)

 

[NC514]

Resister plugs...

All those, including myself, who run the B8es or B9es plugs...Listen up... I have a reason to run the "BR" series type plugs. I have a friend that normally puts a new plug in every time he puts a new top end in. Well over christmas a bunch of my friends went to Mosier Valley in Texas to a riding school. He put a new plug in different than stock. He has an 02 YZ 125 it call for a Br9es I think? Anyway, he broke the bike in when they got to Texas. He went out on the track to ride and noticed a bog in the midrange. He tore the carb, pipe, airbox everything off looking for the problem. He didn't find anthing so he re-assmbled it all. He went back on the track ,it did it again. A friend suggested to try a knew plug, even though he put a new one in it. All he had was the stock plug. He put it in, then it ran fine. Go figure!!

 

[shifter125]

YardPro - I'm waiting til August til my 4th comes along...3 boys under 10 now

Plugs - small motors really respond to small changes. a spark plug is a big change. I buy NGK or Bosch. it's not uncommon to get a dead one in a box, thats why i buy a box of 10 at a time - they make a kagillion plugs a year, a bad one is bound to get through once in a while.

I used to say that 'Champions are the choice of lawn-boy professionals everywhere" but since I changed the Champion plug in my 5 horse briggs-N-scrap-iron mower to an NGK and it starts on the frist pull every time now!

The only time i've seen a Champion Plug in a race engine was in a top fueler -and i asked if they were better or if they used a 'special' one. Kalitta told me that they melt down to nothing and have to get changed every pass, so they run the cheapest, coldest plugs they can get.

I guess the moral of the 'Spark Plug Saga' is to just run what works for you, but that may not work for the next guy.
;)

 

[MN KDXer]

Sometimes, one brand of plug catches a bad rap for fouling while the other brand runs fine. What is typically the case, is that the cross-conversion is not exactly the same heat range, but rather "close". Often times, a over-rich jetting situation adds to the situation, and the mis-fortunate cross-coverted plug is labeled as "junk, when in fact, the plug is too cold for the application. Snowmobilers seem to have a way of falling victim to this senario.


Smooth Sail,

Those Gold Palladium plugs were Champion's fine wire type plug back in the 70's, or at least that's the last time I've seen them. Good plugs BTW, I had a pair in a 1971 Polaris snowmobile which lasted the entire snow season, which was totally unbelieveable back in those old breaker-points days.