Fork spring rate recommendation?

[wanaride]

OK, I'm about to order new fork springs for my '03 200. I weigh 215lbs without gear, and my riding consists almost entirely of woods/trail riding in rocky, rutted stuff...no desert riding here.

The FRP website recommends 0.39kg/mm springs for a guy my size, but the Race Tech website recommends 0.45kg/mm springs for someone my size who rides desert/enduro/trails.

Sounds like a big difference to me...

Can anyone out there make a recommendation on how I resolve these values to come up with a number for ME? I'd like to order them today...

Is one brand better than another, or will they all serve me equally well?

Thanks for your help!

 

[dsndblm]

I got the .39 springs from Kawasaki, I weigh 195 withour gear. They are way too soft for me, wish I would have gone with stiffer spring. I do a lot of desert riding here in Az. Did you do a search for more info in the threads?

 

[wanaride]

I know about the search function, but I'm at work and I can't take the time to crawl through pages and pages of search hits.

I know I should get new springs, I'm just confused on which rate to get.

Your post is useful...Mr. KDX (Jeff Fredette) recommends a 0.39kg/mm spring for riders >210 (without gear), yet you are less than that and claim the 0.39kg/mm spring is too soft for your riding. Of course, your desert riding likely requires a different setup than does my woods riding...

 

[Rhodester]

First of all don't get replacement KDX springs. Get LATE model XR400 springs or XR400 replacement springs. Early XR400s used .38kg springs and later models used .40kg springs. XR400s have a longer spring that will take up more of your fork with spring instead of that cheesy spacer/preloader that comes stock. They also provide a better ride.

I would suggest .40kg or .41kg for your weight and riding conditions. I'm 230lbs (bare) and use .43kg springs (Eibach replacement springs for XR400). My son is 205lbs (bare) and uses .41kg springs in his XR250 (a little heavier bike than the KDX). I do some faster desert riding or I might go with .41kg to retain allot of plushness for woods riding myself. I use 5mm of preload on my .43kg springs.

I would guess that Race Tech uses very light compression damping in their revalved forks and so they can get away with a stiffer spring. .45kg would be too stiff for me unless I was racing, even with the Gold Valves that I have on my forks (set to very light compression damping).

 

[Braahp]

I went through the same thing when I went to buy springs. I got 20 different answers about spring rate. I weigh same as you. Who would know best...............Fredette. Go with the .39's. Anything stiffer will beat you pretty bad in the rough stuff. I use them in mine and even with stock preload metal spacers. I tried the XR 40's. Close but felt weird. I can even go a couple of clicks stiffer on comp and its too stiff with the .39's. Of course I like it plush and have sort of a stiffer GV setup. You'll get a ton of opinions on this subject. Race Tech is way off. They got MX on the brain not real world woods riding. I ride hard and fast and the .39's never bottom unless doing big jumps which I rarely do.

 

[wanaride]

I called FRP and ordered the .40kg/mm springs...they didn't have .39kg/mm in stock. Hopefully this will be an improvement over stock. I hope to get them and install them in time for this weekend.

Yes, I thought the Race Tech numbers seemed VERY stout. Race Tech may know suspension in general, but Fredette knows the KDX, so I look forward to putting them in and "feeling" the difference myself.

Thanks for the help! :cool:

 

[Robcolo]

Wanaride - Wanasell the stock springs ?

I might be interested in buying the OEM springs you're taking out if you like the new ones. Let me know what they're worth !

[email protected]

 

[wanaride]

Will do...

 

[canyncarvr]

You can see from the different flavors of responses that spring choice is largely a matter of personal choice. I tried four different sets before I settled on what suited me. The longer, hotwound (530mm or so) XR spring can't be beat, imo.

The whole idea of taking a fork tube and filling it up with a metal spacer to make a 430mm spring fit makes no sense to me. I still tried that route first. BOO!!

Is one brand better than another?

Yes.

Will either/both serve you equally well?

No.

Well, unless you like changing preload spacers every couple weeks because the spring length changes.

Yeah. It's probably only happened to me. :( Boo-HOO!!

...please pass the cheese...........?

 

[wanaride]

Oh great, I thought I was "coming out ahead" getting the FRP springs and saving $40 over the RaceTech... :(

So, yet another example of getting what I pay for??? :think:

Well, after I learn this lesson and the length of these new springs changes, what exactly do I need to do to use an XR400 spring? Remove the preload spacer? Anything else? What correlation is there between XR400 model year and my 2003 KDX200? In other words, how will I know what type of XR400 spring to get? (Yes, I have a service manual and no, I haven't searched on this yet...just general guidelines will suffice for now.)

Thanks! :worship:

 

[KAY DEE EXER]

Theres tonnes of info about this in the search feature and in the STICKY FAQ post.

 

[Braahp]

You ever wonder why if the XR springs were so great Fredette doesn't use them in his race bikes?

 

[canyncarvr]

No one is raining on anyone else's parade. If I tried four sets of springs and found the XRs to be much better, fine. Likewise, if no one else likes them, that's fine too!

Mr. Fredette didn't like the RB-Designs modified carb, either! Does that mean he's all wet about everything? No.

There are one piece top clamps available that work with the oem bolts, with or without a base for the odo. Last I heard Mr. Fredette's top clamp required some extra washers and fooling around to put it on (I've never seen one of his, don't use one of his, don't know anyone that does use one of his). Does that mean nothing he sells is anything I'd ever want?

That's just silly. His KDX kicker works great!!

If Mr. Fredette likes 430mm coldwound springs (because of the weight difference he told me. I've not weighed the two springs to find out but the wire is not the same thickness on the oem vs: the honda springs. I wouldn't bet the Honda springs are heavier) he is welcome to use them.

Mr. Wilkey (MX-Tech) has found out some interesting things about coldwound springs. Can you say c-r-a-p-o-l-a?

So, I take summa Mr. Fredette, summa Mr. Wilkey, summa Mr. Wilson. Put it all together, mix well and figure it out for myself!

Anyone that wishes can do what someone else tells them to do if they prefer.

Re: XR springs:

Basically, you're looking at this:

From CDave (3-3-03):

It’s the 1996-99 0.38kg/mm XR400 springs that are interchangeable and commonly used in 1995 to 2003 KDX200/220s.

From racetech's site:
'96-99 xr400r 43mm Showa .38
'00-02 xr400r 43mm Showa .40


'H' model kawi spec:
'00 200 KDX 43mm KYB .35

The metal tube in the oem setup is commonly discarded. Cut a piece of schedule-40 PVC to get you to your desired preload. The XR springs are hotwound. Partly that means they are much less likely to change length over time. You can use small preloads (if you wish). I'm currently running about 3mm (that's preload not spacer length). Anyone else should run whatever suits them.

I tried 10mm, 8mm and 5mm preloads before I settled on what I have now. I've used 100mm, 95mm, 110mm, 115mm and 120mm oil levels before I settled on what I use now (the latter).

I chose what I chose because it worked better than the other things I tried. I generally ride single track woods stuff (imagine that on a KDX!) and am not concerned with 70' table top jumps. The most I'm likely to have to deal with is being maybe 5' in the air. Last time that happened (couple weeks ago) when the bike hit the ground it was like putting my foot in a new fleece-lined slipper. No jar, no 'hit', just a smooth, sure, progressive contact.

Of course, that's just one suspension scenario but everything else works as well.

The point is? My bike works.......for me. And I've used both types of springs. As I recall, Braahp has, too! I'll 'let' him use his choice if he 'lets' me use mine!

God Bless America!!

 

[JasonWho]

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[Braahp]

Whoa nellie..............Canyn should be a spokeperson for those XR springs. There is such a conflicting view of whats best for the KDX I was merely hoping others would check out all possibilities before purchasing. Because of such jaded/conflicting views I had to buy numerous springs and try different setups myself. I just ended up prefering the Fredette springs. Cold...hotwound..........who knows........I've never had either fail. Correct that I don't like many other Fredette products also but I trusted his judgment and thinking when it came to springs and he was spot on for me. I tried others but always went back to his setup. To each his own..............its a good thing they make different colored cars. It boils down to personal preference and ones own riding styles and conditions. All in all anyone get the Fredette or XR springs and you'll be happy as a lark. Now Racetechs' specs.................not sure where in the heck they get those.

 

[canyncarvr]

Just because I prattle on for about ever on a particular subject shouldn't be taking as me harping about it.

Well....most of the time! ;)

No 'whoa' required. Part of the point of the thing was that you had your opinion based on your experiences with different springs, and that is what all should do.

Doing anything just cuz someone else says to isn't going to work too well.

Well, 'Get out of the vehicle. Put your hands on your head!!' ..you might wanna do something like that!

 

[JasonWho]

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[yortz]

Wow I am still laughing at the helmeted angle.........

 

[moridin]

There are lots of threads on the XR400 springs. You will find a few with Honda OEM part numbers.

I did it - and love the results. Very big improvement. The front and rear are actually balanced now. Insert, new oil - set the sag and ride. Cant get any easier than that.

 

[RMKDX]

I just installed some .42'sa from race tech last weekend and they work really well. I weigh 205 on a good day (no gear) and 210 on a bad one. Seemed to work fine on off-road and my forty foot table. Highly recommend that rate. Got the info from a dirt rider issue from last summer. They were right they do sound like squeaky bed springs. ;)