Is a 2 stroke the way 2 go for me

[johan]

Hallo To All
I am new to the sport of motocross, so please bear with me if these questions are simple .
I have ridden a few enduros and in all I propably have 12 years riding experience.I am really interrested in buying a 2004 rm 250 since i never could afford a bike of my own.
The questions i have concerns something very important to me and this is maintenance.Can somebody please tell how often you have to replace the topend of these bikes and what would be the longest that you can run the bike without giving it a fresh topend.I have read that they recomend that you dont run a topend longer than 20 hours.If this is the case wont I be better of with a 4 stroke that just need regular oil changes.
I am really on a very tight budget as I am sure it is for a lot of other people and I would really like to know which option would be less expensive than the other in the long run .I plan on buying a bike second hand and I would like to know if one can actually buy a 4 stroke in used condition that can be trust worthy and not cost you a lot of money in the long run when it comes to repairs and such.Last question ;how much higher is the fuel consumption for a 2 stroke versus a 4 stroke and what range can I expect while doing trail riding on a stock rm 250.Please Rm owners can you answer these questions for me .I appreciate all your answers.
Regards
Johan

 

[Rob1111]

How long a top end lasts will be determined by how hard you ride the bike. From what I have been told they typically last about 60 hours. As far as fuel enconomy is concered, a 2 stroke will not last as long on a tank of gas compared to a 4 stroke.

 

[500guy]

Maintenance will be MUCH cheaper on the 2 stroke.

 

[KaTooMer]

The 20-hour top end replacement for a 250 would be for very intense MX riding/racing. You'd have to be riding with the engine wound up very high for most of the time. I'd say 50-60 hours is more like it, especially if some of your riding includes trails. I'm not a 4-stroke guy, so I can't speak directly to the maintenance requirements, but generally the 4-stroke top ends will last longer than 2-strokes. The downside, however, is it seems that there's a lot more adjustments required, frequent oil changes and oil filter adjustments.

For woods riding, the 5 different two-strokes I've owned in the last 10 years (250's and 300's) have all burned about a gallon an hour. But that depends on your riding style. I know people who burn more than that, some less. A 4-stroke will burn less gas, but how much less again depends on your riding style.

 

[ETS]

One of the biggest contributors to the life of a top end is how often you clean your air filter. If you clean it each ride with slightly fat jetting they run a long time. I don't ride nearly as much as I used to but I used to rering my 250 each year with a new piston every other year. Kinda a rotation thing as I was on more of a budget. I never had a seizure and the nicasil bore always looked nice. I owned that 91' KX for five years and the cylinder always looked great and those bikes were known for flaking cylinders. I've had yz400 and 520SX fourstrokes and from my experience the cost of oil changes each year was the cost of a 2stroke top end. I never had four stroke problems but some guys at work that I occasionally ride with have had piston failures on crf450's that were costly. The power will be a handful in the trails though.

 

[gonzo843]

Well I've had and currently have both types of bikes. Everyone says maintenance is so much higher on a 2-stroke. I dont see it. You have to change the oil on both bikes. Actually the 2-stroke is easier because you dont have to change the filter at 10 bucks a pop.. So I guess I am not sure where the extra maintenance is. Sure you have to change the top end more frequently on a 2-stroke but thats only about 70 bucks and on a 250 the average rider could probably go a year. On a 4-stroke you can go 2 years but the top end will cost you between 150 and 200. You might use a little more gas on a 2-stroke but if you get a 250f you would use about the same because you rev them alot higher to get power. Some may also say you have to jet more frequently on a 2-stroke. Well you sort of do but it's alot easier to jet a 2-stroke than a modern YZ 4-stroke because of that stupid hot start cable on the carb has to come off to turn the carb where a 2-stroke you just turn the carb and change the jets. All in all I say its about equal. Also if you have any major issues the 4-stroke will cost alot more than a 2-stroke to repair. IE cams and timing chain, valves, shims etc. Although I must say on a YZ 4-stroke its almost like those dont exist because they never break.

 

[crazyYammi]

I did my bike(rings) this summer with about 80 hours on it and the rings were still in spec, although they were closer to the 'outer' range. I will do piston and rings this winter at about 200 hours.

My biggest expense is tires.

2 stroke topends are very easy now, the gaskets are top notch so there is no banging or scraping... the head came off just by pulling with my hands.

Me and my buddy have a friend and we get a 'kick' out of our buddies(426) starting ritual on cold mornings after he kicks it over for about 20 minutes I give mine one and we are ready to go!

 

[uts]

Since the new four strokes rev so hard I suspect that their top ends wouldn't last any longer than a 2 smoker, or maybe even less.

 

[bclapham]

Since the new four strokes rev so hard I suspect that their top ends wouldn't last any longer than a 2 smoker, or maybe even less.

bingo, and then figure in the cost of valve train maintainance at the same time. :yikes:

 

[gonzo843]

Actually I have over 200 hours on my stock top end on my 450 and about 75 on my 250F. They last alot longer but they are twice as much to replace. Like I said in my previous post its all about the same in the end.

 

[showtime586]

Like Gonzo, I too have both. The messy oil change for the thumper is offset by not having to mix the oil and gas. We all know that if the engine grenades on a thumper it is going to be rather expensive, but I have seen some rods come through the cases of two strokes that were costly to replace as well.
All of this being said, I'm going to suggest that because you are concerned about finances, as many are, you might want to consider a two stroke unless you are just really wanting to go thumpering. I was on strike for 6 months year before last, and I got to the point I wouldn't ride my thumper for fear of the expense involved in engine repairs if something happened to the motor. If your worried about it, you won't enjoy the bike. Just my opinion.

 

[Dirtbike'n man]

its really not that hard to mix pre mix. which is for some a complaint. take a 5 gallon tank and a 32 oz can of premix oil dump 16 oz ( or half) into the tank of gas, give a few shakes, then dump into the bike. it takes all of an extra 3 mins compaird to gasing up a 4 stroke. if u want it even easyer buy the 16 oz can of oil and just dump it all in if dumping in half is too complicated for you... i would get a two stroke if i were you. nothin like a light flickable bike.

 

[johan]

Thank you

Hey everybody
Thanks for all the reply's ,I appreciate it a lot.I think I am a ring ding man and proud of it.I did a lot of trail rides in both Brazil and South Africa and everytime the bikes would stall ,it would just require one kick if you were on a 2 stroke and you were off again.I must say I learned a few colorful words both in Portugese and some in Afrikaans from the fourstroke guys especially if their bikes swamped in a river or if they stalled[kicking a big 4 stroke brings out the best in people]
In the mud which Brazil is known for the 2 stroke power delivery would be a little bit abrupt if the powerband kicks in and that would make you spin out or lose your line.
The only advice there would be to upshift and keep the wheels rolling and not spinning.My wife's uncle who I would ride with has 2 YZ 250's and I think there is nothing that can kill those bikes.We would tip over or fall 20 times a day and all you would have to do was to pick it up ,kick it and off you go.
Parts and their availibility is there and in South Africa of big concern ,because if you live in a third world country,you pay for your "toys" and their parts.At this moment 2 stroke parts are a little bit more availible ,because the bikes have been around a little bit longer so that is another thing for me to concider.
At this point of time you would need just over $11000 to buy a 2004 rm 250 in South Africa and I believe it is ditto for Brazil,so that is why I am shopping for a bike here in the States while I am here.
Please if you or anybody else have more input on my questions ,please post it ,I would like to learn as much as possible so please keep posting.
Regards
Johan

 

[_j0kA_]

i have an 04rm250.. raced, practiced, fmxed and trail rode a little bit and i changed the top end not to long ago.. if your not riding hard you can easily get 2-3 years out of the stock top end... although it would be nice to buy a piston/rings/gaskets and rebuild it once a year (yourself)..
i have close to 200 hours on my bike now, about 100hours were on the stock piston and another 100 on the replacement that comes with the bike new..

go 2 stroke, there awesome

 

[Buckholz]

Johan, we run our two strokes typically a year to a year and a half on a topend, usually about 2000-3000 miles of singletrack racing. We are all mostly expert/A riders. Figureing about 20 to 30 miles an hour average, that is around 100 hours of racing. Our 4 stroke buddies can sometimes go a little longer, but boy, if you run them too long without maintenance, the catastrophic failures are really expensive, in the $1000+ range.

We are all very anal retentive about air filter maintenance, gentle warmup, and running freshly mixed high quality synthetic oil premix. I have owned a YZ426WR and an XR650R (four strokes), and sold them after a coupla years of hard riding on their original topends, but kinda had my fingers crossed during their last 6 months, worried something bad would happen and it would cost me an arm and a leg to replace parts. Plus, I got to hate changing 4 stroke oil, and checking/adjusting valves every 600-1000 miles of riding.

I plan to continue racing two strokes as long as they continue to sell em!

My major expense in riding is fresh tires.

 

[D Lafleur]

I have both also, and I am seeing about the same time between topends with the 4 stroke and 300 2 strokes. The differance is about $600 a year more to run the 4 stroke. This is due to oil, filters and parts. I am also anal about my air filters, engine oil and such. You can add 3 hours of maintenance a month to run a 4 stroke. I just cant ignore the adjustments, I have to sleep at night.

By the way, I just picked up an 05 RM 250 and it is the sweetest 250 I have ever had.

 

[johan]

Thanks

Thank you to everybody that had some input and posted it.I really appreciate it .
:aj: Slip the clutch and give her hell :aj:
Regards
Johan

 

[Chief]

Johan,

I have an '01 for sale. Click on my pics if you are interesed.

Goodluck!!!!

Joe Chief