Jul 9, 2005
28
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I do not recall anyone saying that 21 to 40 was full - I do recall comment about that was all they were going to fill now (before 20).-By KTMMike

The first time through sign up they told us they were only filling 1-20 "right now". They also said they will open later minutes as needed once 1-20 filled. We were told this after watching a few guys in front of us walk out with 30's.(first LMC mistake)

Now about the minute 18. This was the second time around through sign up when things got heated. We had been told 1-20 had TO FILL BEFORE LATER NUMBERS WOULD OPEN. And now this time they offered us a number "like" 18. It was lower than 20 I didnt mean to point you out it may have been 15 they said but the point is they said before 20, but they stated earlier 1-20 had to be filled already before they opened late minutes. Ok well this is now the end of sign up and now they are completly changing what they said and are now saying 30-40 is FULL and we only have early minutes left (This is where I said 18 but I didnt mean exactly 18, just that it was a minute less than 20) tell me how they can have early minutes left if they told us they had to fill before late minutes would open.

All I am explaining is that the LMC was bluntly saving numbers for people they know. They had no reason or consistancy as to how they handed out numbers. Its weird how 1-20 has to fill before anything else will open up until a LMC friend walks in and suddenly the late minutes open up....only for a second though. Its cheating.
 

TCTrailrider

Member
Jan 19, 2004
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I for one had a great time. The amount of new Event trail was awsome. I love jumping logs and having low branches trying to remove me from my bike. Our ORV system has become so wide and fast, its hard to find enjoyment in it. The Northern section through the briar patch, then the off camber and then the saplings was perfect. I'm older than most, slower than most, and not a threat, but none of you enyoy the tight stuff more than me.
Lots of the previous posts had good constructive critisism, and thats a good thing. I'm sure those in charge have read or will be directed to these posts. All will learn and apply the lessons to future events. So lets let it die and not rub salt in the wound.
My concern is that those who gave so much of there time and effort to this event will pass on future possibilities to avoid being second guessed. There are two sides to every story.
I am not a member of LMC, I have no agenda other than riding tight stuff. So for a moment try to imagine this senario. Tom Dunn offered up his help to create an additional Enduro this year. LMC offered to help. LMC like most volunteer organizations has a small core of active members. They are responsible for maintaining miles of ORV trail near the lodge. The Jack Pine Enduro there mother of events has to take enormous effort. After those commitments my guess is finding help for an additional Enduro is difficult at best.
 

TCTrailrider

Member
Jan 19, 2004
980
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I've heard the DNR finalized the permits 2-3 weeks before the event. So a small group of commited workers, lets say 5-6 tromp through the woods finding property lines and staple arrows to trees. With that much new trail 20 workers would of had two full days.
I say thanks to Tom Dunn for the idea, thanks to all who helped, thanks to all who rode. That stuff was awsome. :yikes:
 
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Jul 9, 2005
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Its great that they put on an Enduro, but I think in this situation the "let it die" approach will only make it worse. I recently had a convorsation with a fellow Muskegon Motorcyle Club member that told me LMC has done this type of thing for years and it goes without objection. And for you guys that are just out to enjoy the trail it may be fine and dandy. But personally I race to win or at least do the best I can. By the LMC clearly giving a guy just ahead of me in line a late minute for a virgin trail race and then denying me the same treatment he just received and then they expect me to compete against him in the A class. Some may think its a load of crap and if your fast you can beat them anyway but I pay the same entry fee as him and I want to win as bad or worse than that guy on the late minute who has a way easier trail to follow. And it is also very discouraging to even start a race knowing in your head they already have an advantage on you.
So yes I agree thanks for putting on an Enduro Tom but leave the cheating and favoritism at home next time.
 

Fred T

Mi. Trail Riders
LIFETIME SPONSOR
Mar 23, 2001
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I know for a fact that the AMA has already contacted Tom Dunn about this so let's just let it rest now. I think all important points have been made. Thanks for all the great feedback. Long live Enduros!
 

TCTrailrider

Member
Jan 19, 2004
980
0
Our Wednesday riding group is riding tomorrow at the scene of the crime, pulling 65 miles of arrows. :bang: The DNR told Tom he would be fined $5.00 for each missed arrow. It must suck being Tom right now. :laugh:
 

BSWIFT

Sponsoring Member
N. Texas SP
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Nov 25, 1999
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Not sure exactly why this thread was closed but I will not second guess the decision. It appears that the issue is being taken up on the District level and that is a good thing. Several valid issues and points were made and it might just be a good thing to let the issue cool for a few days. The mod that closed the thread CAN re-open this thread if they so choose to. If I can help or if you would like to give me additional info on why the thread was locked please send me a PM.
Brian
 
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woodsy

~SPONSOR~
Mi. Trail Riders
Jan 16, 2002
2,933
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Sheesh you guys, I leave town for a while and BOOM, an uproar starts..
Soooooo,,, my 2 pennys....
Cheating in competition is never good. It devalues the sport, can cause those who are actually in the competition for serious competition to lose heart and ultimitaly, give the outside world the wrong impression of all involved.
It may not sound serious to some but this is a VERY serious matter. As a person who was/is directly effected by these kinds of issues (in both business and personal life) I BEG the powers that be to find ways to make sure this doesnt continue in the future!!
Now, how about putting our minds together and find solutions that could be inacted?? Are you part of the problem or part of the solution??
How about having some certified, unbiased, trail riding riders - you could call them "The On Any Monday Trail Riders" or "The Ill Legals" come in and Pre-Ride the fresh virgin trail to break it in for all the races. Then it wouldnt matter where you started and a lottery could be utilized to further mix the competition up.. Dont laugh, there are MANY ways this could be done. If trophies dont matter to someone they should be the first in line to accept a non-eliglble for racing status to get to do such a thing. There are lots of ways this could really benefit the sport.... If this passes, dont forget who thought of it and put my name first on the list at all Enduro's with Virigin trail to help break in trail :laugh:
Really, thats all I am asking for my idea here - Permanant line 1 in the non-competitors status and I will do my part free of charge!!! Hows that for a spin???
Again, as someone who has always watched the National Results and admires those people who FAIRLY earned their status as a competitor - I urge anyone who is reading this and has authority to change things for the better to do so!!

Scott Barnhard/Woodsy
Trail Rider and Professional Trail Breaker Inner
 

Wolverine423

~SPONSOR~
Oct 2, 2005
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Other than your caliber woodsy your average trail rider would have been well over his or hers head breaking trail on this enduro. Most trail riders like easy open riding like 2 tracks -white cloud -cedar creek ect...

DW
 

woodsy

~SPONSOR~
Mi. Trail Riders
Jan 16, 2002
2,933
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Wolverine423 said:
Most trail riders like easy open riding like 2 tracks -white cloud -cedar creek ect...

DW

icky
 
Jul 9, 2005
28
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I like tight trails too but not when I have to ride it real tight and compete with the guy who gets the two track because he knows the people at sign up. Sorry but Im there to race and compete in a fair environment.

Thanks for the input everyone I hope it opens some eyes and ears.
Briggsracing23
(Muskegon Motorcycle Club)
 

Okiewan

Admin
Dec 31, 1969
29,555
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It was closed by me, at the request of one of the forum leaders. It's felt the thread has run it's course. I'm not going to over-rule him.
 


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