Questionable law enforcement tatics

[Casper250]

All of the places that I ride, except for the track I go to are illegal. Now, there are places where people have been riding for years and for the most part, the cops leave you alone. In the spring time, it seems like the cops go into overdrive trying to get as many people for trespassing as they can. Now, I have never had a problem with cops in the 5 years I have been riding at these area's but I've been hearing some stories that are a little disturbing.

First one is that a plain clothed cop with a quad will tip it over and lay down next to it like he fell off and got hurt. When you stop to help, they bust you.

Second one is they wait on the side of a trail where it's a little narrow and slow and jump in front of you, when you stop, they put a zip ty over your clutch lever so you can't ride away. Then they give you a ticket.

Last, I heard that they try to grab the visor on your helmet to knock you off balance and try to get you to stop.

I've heard these same stories from 3 separate people on 3 separate occasions. One of them was a personal friend, the two others were just people I met riding. The second tatic I listed isn't so bad but the first one and last one kind of piss me off. They are using the goodwill of helping some one that is hurt against you. After I heard that one, I don't stop for any thing or anyone when i'm riding.

 

[KDX1]

I wouldn't exactly say those are ethical tactics either. I live in West Virginia and have never had any problems like that. There are plenty of places to ride and I usually make it a rule to stay away from posted areas, but as a rule of thumb as long as there are no fences or posted signs it's all fair game. Be careful, it's a jungle out there!

 

[john stu]

the cops here in mass will use all of the above and then some!! they flat out lied in court when i tryed to fight a ticket making up all sorts of stuff that i never did .....i won anyway woo hoo

 

[Bodge]

Ive heard that they have pulled a gun on a guy around here, i didnt see it though. It could be true, but hopefully not. Usually around here they just bring their jeep in to clear the pit out, they also do a spring and fall raid, but nothing too great.

 

[tyesai]

You guys just need to move out to redneck country, middle America rules, I have never heard of the cops doing anything like that, hell the sheriff told one guy it was ok to ride his quad down the road in town as long as he wasn't speeding and stopped at the redlight. You might get shot at though for trespassing.

 

[RM_guy]

I'm in no way supporting those tactics but if you are going to trespass then be prepared to deal with the consequences. A lot of the reason we are losing riding areas is because people are trespassing and pissing land owners off. If you can’t get permission to ride somewhere than DON’T RIDE THERE.

 

[tony91]

Bottom line is, if you weren't trespassing you wouldn't have to deal with it. You've got to find a legal place to ride.

 

[a454elk]

Ditto. Sometimes stories get a little changed once they've gone through a few folks as well. Unless I've seen it myself, or 89r told me, then I don't buy it, sorry.

 

[Casper250]

Long Island

area - 1198 square miles

Public riding areas - 0

 

[oldguy]

Long Island

area - 1198 square miles

Public riding areas - 0

And your point??? Buy some of that 1198 sq miles and open your own riding area. Nobody owes you a place to ride on their land

 

[rickyd]

I'd stay off the private property, if i were a land owner i wouldnt want people riding w/out my permission.. Have you tried getting permissiopn from the land owners?? I dont agree too mot of those tactics, if they did happen..
RIck

 

[Treejumper]

I usually make it a rule to stay away from posted areas, but as a rule of thumb as long as there are no fences or posted signs it's all fair game.

Just cause there are no signs doesnt make it fair game. We have 70 acres that isnt posted and allow people to ride on over half of it if They ask! If you dont ask you get thrown off for good.

 

[a454elk]

California, over 30,000 square miles, too many legal riding areas to count, priceless...

 

[TwinSpar]

California, over 30,000 square miles, too many legal riding areas to count, priceless...

Yeah... but that goofy sticker system isn't exactly nirvana.

 

[john stu]

funny thing if you play baseball.....the town builds you a park......football same thing....hocky they build ice rink....the list goes on and on here in mass they even build skate parks if you ride skate boards .......but dont ride a dirt bike or they will arrest you anyway they can...trust me i got a ticket and had to go to court and the place i was riding is on the LEAGLE places to ride list that i got right when i paid the sales tax and regestration fees! and the cops gave me a 450$ ticket!! i won in court but man what a pain in the A$$ loosing a work day

 

[rickyd]

Yeah... but that goofy sticker system isn't exactly nirvana.

It's not as bad as everybody thinks.. minor compared too our gun laws..

 

[Oldschooldeathwish]

I just try to ride on crown land ( Land that belongs to the people of the country, hell you could pitch a tent on it and live there all year and no one would do anything about it ) I wouldnt knowingly ride on private property without permission though

 

[70 marlin]

Join a dirt bike club. Start racing Enduro's or Hare scrambles. There many fine clubs that aren’t all that far from you. It's people like you that's getting more of the legal land closed! Be part of the solution not part of the problem!

 

[snb73]

Be proactive. When in doubt, call the local police department and ask before you ride. If an area is questionable, ask. Better than getting a ticket or your bike impounded.

Maybe if a group of you got together and had a meeting with the sherrif/cheif, you might find a place to ride. You'd be amazed at what you can accomplish when you open chains of communication. Do a tax search, find who owns the land, and get permission to ride there.

I remember when I was 13 and used to run from the cops. At 37, if I'm approached by a police officer, I stop and remove my hemet. I'm an adult now. I told my 13 year old son if he is ever approached by the police, stop and be courtious. If he doesn't run and they impound the bike, I'll pay to get it out, no problem. But if he runs, he can say good bye to his bike.

 

[truespode]

When I was a kid I stopped the cop that patrolled the area around my house and asked him about riding from house to house on my bike and on trails.

He said as long as nobody complained I could do it but try to stay to the side of the road.

When there were trails that came close to peoples house I would always go up and ask if I could ride there. Some said no and I had to find a new way around but most said yes.

As a matter of fact, one person who said no ran into me at a high school basketball game where their child was a cheerleader. They remembered that I asked and that I had not ridden there since that day and was impressed that I kept my word so they said it was ok for me and my friends to ride through from now on.

People are a lot more willing to let people do things if they like the person so it pays off to be nice when you can.

Most people (even cops :p ) are reasonable and will work with you if you make a reasonable request and there is the option to say yes.

Ivan

 

[tnrider]

today, it mostly comes down to financial risk for the land owner. even if you have homeowner insurance covering liability, it may cover the first accident but they will then cancel your policy - and good luck getting future insurance with that on your record.

just look at what happens when you are injured on an "official" riding area. i was injured last year on a practice track, had signed waivers, did not sue -- but my health insurance carrier sure wanted to, i am pleased that they ultimately did not. However, if you read the fine print of many policies, you are legally required to assist them in cost recovery. they don't care about signed waivers and THEY did not sign the waiver, i signed that i would not sue - that does not prevent the insurance co from trying to get reimbursement for their expenses.

another example, from my past experience in auto racing at the national level - the organizers at even pro events would remind the drivers/crew to please remind their family that they are doing this of their own free will and to not sue the event/track/organizers/etc... in the event of an accident. the events had coverage for catastrophic health insurance - but only a few million in total liability - one death or lifetime disability would easily eat 10's of millions in insurance.

this is the #1 reason why people don't want others riding on their property.

 

[oldguy]

This whole thread reminds me of when we first purchased the lot on which we now live. It is only 4 acres but the main access trail from a subdivision of about 200 homes to the state horse/snowmobile trails went thru the far north end of our property. This was no problem with me the 1st 2 years I owned the property. the 3rd year we built our home and as part of the landscaping I planted 400 pine trees. As soon as we started construction during the spring several horse riders stopped and asked if they could still use the trail and I said yes but asked that they please stay on the established trail away from the trees. For the most part they all did this and I had no problem with them. Before winter I put a large sign at the corner orf our property advising all snowmobilers to stop by before riding because I knew the smaller trees would be covered by drifts in some places. This sign was large enough to be read from any car driving out of the subdivision but I had exactly 1 person stop to talk. first snowfall I had at least 25 snowmobiles go thru that day and as the trail got packed they started widening it eventually working into the trees and running over at least 50 of them. Next day there was a fence across the opening into the yard with a sign that no snowmolies were allowed. I had 2 guys stop by and I explained the situation and after assurances they would abide by MY rules and spread the word I ok'd them to come thru as long as they closed the gate.
This worked for a week or so but then the gate was torn down and the problem began again. The 3 guys that had permission stopped and told me who had torn the gate down and described his machine. Within a couple days I saw him riding thru wide open and right thru the nice fresh snow on top of the trees again. I got his registration numbers and being the local cop I mailed him the tresspasing ticket. He showed up with his dad both just screaming that I had no right to do this and was only going to cause more problems. As soon as I brought to thier attention that the name signed on the ticket and the coincidance that it was the same as mine and if they didn't leave immediately they would be facing more problems they seemed a bit calmer and began asking permission.
The alternative I gave them was to provide poles and mark a trail where I told them to and to stay on it- they refused saying that they didn't have to if I wanted that I should do it. My response was I didn't want them on my property with snowmobiles in the first palce and they were now not welcome.
After that only 5 machines were allowed to use the trail but I didn't need to write any more tickets. It seems like a small thing but in order to access the trails without trailerring my yard was a key link in the trail.
I may sound hard ass (I am with my own property) and anti snowmobile (definately not) but the 5 guys with permission and the horse people are all still welcome and regularily still use the trail 16 years later

 

[BSWIFT]

I'm in no way supporting those tactics but if you are going to trespass then be prepared to deal with the consequences. A lot of the reason we are losing riding areas is because people are trespassing and pissing land owners off. If you can’t get permission to ride somewhere than DON’T RIDE THERE.

This is truely good advise. Once you buy your own land and you are the one paying the taxes and mortgage, you will have a different perspective. Riding dirtbikes illegally on private property is primarily a liability issue for the land owner. On the other hand, others trespassing on the same property could be doing something far more sinister and dangerous. Meth Labs pop up everywhere and these idiots will out-right kill you to prevent you from disclosing the operations.
On my land, if someone asked me for permission to ride I would get certain information from them. If they were minors, I would require their parents meet with me and sign a statement of responsibility and a liability waiver. The legal ramifications of riding on land without permission opens the land owner up to HUGE financial risks.
Ride legal, wear your gear, and respect the rights of others.

 

[mtk]

In Pennsylvania, the Legislature passed a law that if you allow public recreation on your land, you're not liable in any way for what happens to the folks on it. Solved the abulance chaser problem quite nicely.

The local landfill used to have to chase dirt bikes off their land all the time, mainly because one idiot rode off the high wall. He dropped over 90 feet and had to be airlifted out with a bunch of broken bones and such. I'm sure he sued them and eventually lost, but it cost them money to defend it. Since the law passed, they don't care as the aforementioned law is a slam-dunk dismissal for them. They fenced off the active cell and the rest of their land is wide open. Dirt bikes ride there all the time and don't go anywhere near the active cell. A kid down the street from me laid out a small practice MX track on the property so he can practice motos. The only problem now is the "railroad cops" writing tickets for people riding along the tracks, which are a OHV superhighway in this area. It's rare, but they do it on occasion. Funny thing is, I've been stopped at a road crossing on the tracks when a local cop drove by and rather than stop, I waved, he waved, and we both went on our merry way. Works for me.

But I also try and respect the folks who live along the tracks. When I pass their house, I slow down and try and keep the noise down. I wave at the landowner. I slow way down for the little old lady walking her dog along the tracks, so as to not scare her or her dog. She smiles and waves in appreciation. When I see mountain bikers, I slow down and give them a wide berth.

I think it also goes back to "country folk" versus the "suburbanite." Where I live now is more rural and is populated with "country folk." They consider dirt bikes as natural as farm tractors, hunting, and all the rest. Where I grew up, just six miles down the road, is bigtime suburbia, populated with a bunch of PITA (not the animal group, but "Pain In The ___") people who live to cause others grief about their grass being too long, the boat parked in the driveway, and all the rest.

 

[Casper250]

This area that i'm talking about is not near any house or buisness. It's not like they are riding in some ones back yard. This place has a parking lot on the back and right side of it, power lines to the left and a highway right infront. Typicle riding area with garbage and junked cars laying around. There are no signs anywhere and no fences or anything around it.

Idon't usually ride at this place and 80% of the time I go riding at the track near me. I was just taken back at the kind of tactics that the cops are using lately. Usually they just come in and chase every one out. If you had a trailer and had to load your bike up, they would ticket those people. It seems lately that they are getting more aggressive.

I've heard this from my friend who is 26, a guy i ride with some time who is 21, and from a group of kids that were in Jr. high. They all told me about this so I started to believe it after that.