While emanating from the MX scene, I am pleased to see that more and more folks are abandoning the exotic and expensive thumpers for 2 strokes. Less costly to buy and maintain, simplistic in operation and repair, and often more fun to ride, the 2 strokes are finding renewed interest in the racing crowd. Obviously MX has little to do with the ownership of a KDX, there is however a parrallel here in that both KDX owners and MX 2 stroke converts recognize good thing when they see it. It gives hope that the buying public are tired of acting like sheep by following the dictates of the commercial controlled media.
The public's return to 2 strokes
- Thread starter duke
- Start date
- Aug 2, 2000
- 13,504
- 19
yeah, that's why I bought a 4-stroke. The media told me to.
Philistine!
Philistine!
flyingfuzzball
Member
- May 10, 2007
- 957
- 0
When was the last time you saw a dirtbike on the news?
reepicheep
Member
- Apr 3, 2009
- 670
- 2
Having blown up and rebuilt a 4 stroke, then bought and restored a blown up 2 stroke (KDX)... I hope to never own another 4 stroke dirt bike.
Comparing two strokes to four strokes, when both are running it's more or less a wash... 4 stroke has a great wide non fussy powerband, but a 2 stroke is lighter and more powerful.
But compare both bikes after some kind of mechanical issue though, and I can probably completely rebuild the 2 stroke motor with 1/4 the money and 1/4 the time.
Comparing two strokes to four strokes, when both are running it's more or less a wash... 4 stroke has a great wide non fussy powerband, but a 2 stroke is lighter and more powerful.
But compare both bikes after some kind of mechanical issue though, and I can probably completely rebuild the 2 stroke motor with 1/4 the money and 1/4 the time.
- Aug 2, 2000
- 13,504
- 19
having never ignored the maintenance of any dirt bike I've owned enough to have blown it up, the 4-stroke is still my favorite.
you luddites can have your 2-strokes. Good luck getting parts in the next decade or so.
you luddites can have your 2-strokes. Good luck getting parts in the next decade or so.
domino dave
Member
- Sep 24, 2003
- 136
- 0
Oh boy ... we got a good thread going here ... Me ?? I love all things 2 stroke. Got a lot of friends who ride 4-stroke, and have been able to ride a lot of their bikes ... When I went from my '77 PE 250 to my KDX I considered a 4-stroke ... just wasn't me ... cackitty-cack trips my trigger!! My boat ... V-6 two stroke, turns me on. My favorite part of taking care of my yard ... you guessed it ... weedeater! Got my eyes on a sweet RZ-350 for my next street bike. All that said, I hope anyone free enough to love riding dirt is not swayed by media or anyone else ... All you guys passionate about what you ride, I am with you ... No matter what it is. Domino
Well said Dave! I totally agree. Any more, 4t vs 2t is not a matter of which is better for what. Either bike can be tuned in many different ways for different purposes, so it's much more about what every makes you grin the most, personally.
And this:
And this:
, SWEET! If you get it, there must be a long picture thread on it. A friend of mine has one, it's intense!domino dave said:
- Jul 20, 2009
- 417
- 0
I owned a KLX450 and of all the bikes I have ever owned it was the only one I disliked (hated actually). Give me a CR500 anyday. I must admit I did love my XR600R though and I really like my son's KLX300. I think 4 strokes have their place, but these high reving short skirted piston titanium valved wallet eating 4 strokes are not for me. My next bike will be a CR500 to go along with my KDX.
- Jul 20, 2009
- 417
- 0
Nothing like an 82hp 101kg 700cc 2 stroke mx bike. Try getting those specs out of a 4 stroke.
http://www.maicointernational.com/
http://www.maicointernational.com/
MyckMcClung
Member
- Sep 19, 2009
- 12
- 0
It really bothers me that the manufacturers are killing thier 2 stroke lines, the majority of riders really can't afford to maintain a racing 4 stroke. 4 strokes are loud heavy and expensive. I'll own and ride 2 strokes as long as I can get one used or not.
Joburble said:
That thing makes 82 hp only in the same fantasy world that you guys seem bound and determined to reside in. ;)
Rich Rohrich said:
Model: 700 M.X.
Cooling: Water
Inlet system: Reed Valve system
Exhaust system: S.E.E.S. exhaust system
Cylinder capacity: 685ccm
Measures: 100 x 87mm
KW/horsepower: 60/82
Carburetor: BING 55/44-205
Transmission: 5 speed gearbox
Ignition: PVL digital
Frame: Chrom Molybdän
Front fork: White Power Upside Down 48 mm
Front brake: Brembo with 260 mm Wave disc
Front wheel travel: 305mm
Front rim: 1.6 - 21
Front tyres: 80/100 _ 21
Rear suspension: Maico Twin Link with Reiger shock
Rear brake: Brembo with 220 mm wave disc
Rear rim: 2.15 - 18
Rear tyres: 120/100 - 18
Tank: 9,5 Liter
Wheel base: 1480 mm
Ground clearance: 388mm
Seat height: 960mm
Weight: 101 kg
Guess Maico lives in this fantasy world with us, so I'm happy to be here! :nener:
Julien, have you ever seen a real world dyno run on that bike? Neither have I. Nice idea, may be possible, but the truth, a 55hp off road bike is too big for most uses. Some of us, 25hp is overkill! For all I know, the only place that bike exists, is on the internet? Now if Yamaha put their 250 smoker in a setup like their 2010 450, that would be something positive! All we need is a solid motor and chassis, we know people to fix the rest.
I saw the maico page a few months back but never converted the kg's wow 222 lbs!!!
would this be a scary frek'n bike or what!!
As for the debate I love all things two wheeled, but own more 4t than 2t I prefer to keep the 4 stroke air cooled and my favorite is my xt350 in full dual-sport trim its 264lbs
hell you would think the lastest offerings from the big four w/250cc's would be able to wiegh in at 230lbs but most are real close to 300 ...yamaha being the worst
If kawasaki would make an auluminum framed klx300-klx450 dual sport that could wiegh 230lbs with the good suspension and plug it up as much as they had to for emmisions I'm certain we out here in the field could "fix" it and too they would sell faster than they could produce... with the lastest in fuel injection they could program for emissions and sell a handle bar mounted button to toggle between the "legal setup" and off road performance set up.
woops way off topic sorry
would this be a scary frek'n bike or what!!
As for the debate I love all things two wheeled, but own more 4t than 2t I prefer to keep the 4 stroke air cooled and my favorite is my xt350 in full dual-sport trim its 264lbs
hell you would think the lastest offerings from the big four w/250cc's would be able to wiegh in at 230lbs but most are real close to 300 ...yamaha being the worst
If kawasaki would make an auluminum framed klx300-klx450 dual sport that could wiegh 230lbs with the good suspension and plug it up as much as they had to for emmisions I'm certain we out here in the field could "fix" it and too they would sell faster than they could produce... with the lastest in fuel injection they could program for emissions and sell a handle bar mounted button to toggle between the "legal setup" and off road performance set up.
woops way off topic sorry
longtime coming
Member
- Mar 18, 2006
- 265
- 0
I have gotten the impression in the past that many of you believe the two stroke is dead, or at least should die. That's only going to happen in the "fantasy world".
helio lucas
~SPONSOR~
- Jun 20, 2007
- 1,020
- 0
the european brands are not lonely in the quest for selling they´re 2-stroke engined mx bikes since yamaha had returned to the production and selling of 2 stroke mx bikes after stoping for one year.
this is very good news because now we have one more valid option in the deal moment of the deal and not just another exotic bike...
this is very good news because now we have one more valid option in the deal moment of the deal and not just another exotic bike...
longtime coming
Member
- Mar 18, 2006
- 265
- 0
I saw more two strokes at the local mx races this year. Many of them doing very well against the dastardly "dark side". If they would just let the 2 strokes run head to head around here, the entire face of the starting line would change, especially in the 250f class. De-tuned 250 2 strokes would rule there.
julien_d said:
Many years back when I worked for Vic "Mr Know It All" Krause in his Maico shop I foolishly quoted a spec sheet in an attempt to prop up a wobbly ill-conceived argument. He laughed and said, " don't believe everything you read because paper accepts all ink".
There wasn't an International Horsepower Accuracy Commission keeping those mooks honest back then, and not much has changed.;)
I still have more two-strokes in my personal collection than four-strokes and they are bikes I'll likely keep forever, but you guys are kidding yourselves if you think the two-strokes as we know them today (light, simple, inexpensive) will be anything other than a fading memory in the future.
For two-strokes to become viable on a large scale going forward they will likely have to change to the point that we'll barely recognize them.
People routinely make grand statements about how they would love a direct injection two-stroke, and they know the technology is there to keep two-strokes clean.
What seems to get missed in these chest thumping soap box proclamations becomes clear once the harsh light of reality hits things. You quickly see that to obtain that goal you have to at least initially make the beloved two-stroke heavier, more complicated, and considerably more expensive. While I'd love to have a Direct Injection RZ350 to replace my aging carbureted LC350, I'm not foolish enough to delude myself into thinking it could happen without huge changes to the characteristics that made the bike desirable in the first place. I guess I'll have to look elsewhere for that elusive "free lunch".
Last edited:
longtime coming
Member
- Mar 18, 2006
- 265
- 0
2 strokes will die when internal combustion dies IMO, but not before. The "light, simple, inexpensive" statement is probably true. Politics seems to allow a lot of pollution in industry, but attacks lesser polluters (like cow farts!). Engineers now seem to embrace the complex and discard the simple but effective, also. Oh well, times change, but usually cycle. I remember the first 4 stroke street bike I bought (after a few 2 strokers); man that smelled good, after all the 2 stroke smoke. It was before I ever had a pick-up truck. As a kid, I thought a bike that smelled and sounded like a car was pretty cool. Now I'm back to loving the smell and sound of a "singing" 2 stroke, knowing full well that eventually there will be some 4 stroke dirt bikes in our future around here. The "non-competitive" thing is definately BS though. 2 strokes are starting to win here at the local level again. Some people will change back to 2 strokes for a while, I think. Until the manufacturers are forced for whatever reasons to lose what makes a 2 stroke good ("light, simple, inexpensive"). We'll end up on electric bikes maybe. They won't sound or smell right, but probably perform well. :ride: "Never" always happens, it seems.
