Value of Powervalve on 85's

[bishop_d]

Well, it's getting about time to start looking at moving my 10 year old up to an 85. After the fiasco I had with the KTM 65 we purchased used, I'm pretty sure that I'm going to buy new this time.

As of yet, I haven't decided which 85 to purchase. We ride mostly in the So. Cal desert, and do lots of trails and climbing, so I think we want something with decent bottom end. From what I hear, this pretty much rules out the Honda. Red being my favorite color, I'm now at a loss.

What I'm curious about is what everyone thinks about the new 85's with powervalves. I believe the Kawi and Suzuki both come with them for 03. Any idea on if other will follow for 04? Does the powervalve help out a lot on the bottom end, or are we just as well off going with a Yamaha. My son is a little on the shorter side, and I believe the Yami has the lowest seat height and the Kawi & Suzuki the highest.

I'm sure this has be debated on here over and over, but I'm just looking for everyone's latest opinions on this class of bike.

Thanks,

deano...
D-37 V7x
TWMC #1 Enduro club of So. Cal again

 

[ktmdad]

The powervalve really helps on the trials. My son prefers the RM85, but it is the tallest of the four.

 

[Racer#213]

The kx85 is more novice friendly. I'd say look at teh rm85 if he can fit. But i have a kx100 and it has excellent power and has been very reliably so far, so i don't see why the kx85 should be much different. the rm has mor top for the desert though.

 

[bishop_d]

If I go for the RM, I'm afraid I may have to hold out for a few more months in hopes of him gaining an inch or so.

Anyone know the difference in the lowest possible seat height (forks all the way up in clamps, and pre-load backed all the way off the rear) of the RM and KX? I know I can find specs on their respective web sites, but I believe that's standard set up.

dean

 

[Racer#213]

the kx has a 33.5" seat height, were the rm has a 34.25" seat height. sot eh kx your already down 1". then move the fors up and pre-load you could prolly get it down to 32" possible. The kx is a little mellower, so you may want that for the woods.

 

[Humdinger]

As for power valves or "KIPS". Kawasaki has a patent on it so you will only find it on Kawasaki and Suzuki as they share the same motor. I dont know of any differences in the two motors. In my opinion there would be no difference in the two besides the seat height and the color. I found a super deal on a KX100 and bought it for my son who had a TTR125 and he loves it and has progressed beyond anyones expectations. I wish I had bought a 85 because the 100 puts him in the super mini class as a first time racer. I dont think this is the class for a first time racer to start in.

 

[Philip]

Deano as a owner of red I can tell you that for trails you would be spending a lot of time on the clutch. If you do some mods you can make it acceptable but that would be up to you. I found the CR good for us because Josh came off a XR70 and the mild power band was good for him. Now that he is used to it we are changing rear gearing and new reed cage and pipe. Many who have done this find it has better power down low. I know this doesn't help much and I can't tell you much about the other brands but just wanted to give you some first hand experience with the Red. Our friend has a YZ and he goes through clutches, so I would imagine if you are a trail rider you might want to keep this in mind. Maybe some YZ owners can offer more advice.

Philip

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by Humdinger
you will only find it on Kawasaki and Suzuki as they share the same motor. I dont know of any differences in the two motors.

The 100s are the same.

The 85s are completely different.

 

[DEANSFASTWAY]

Yeah and the earlier RM motor the cyl was reboreable

 

[Ryno149]

I would just like to restate what Vic said: THE KX & RM 85'S ARE NOT THE SAME, THEY ARE 2 COMPLETELY DIFFERENT BIKES, THE 100'S ON THE OTHER HAND, ARE THE SAME. I ride a KX 100 in the woods and i love it. It has a really smooth powerband so it doesn't wear you out near as quick. It's got alot of low end, really meaty mid-range, and pretty good top end. It's got really good suspension in stock form also. It's also very reliable and durable. I've thrown the bike down so many times it's not even funny(just ask my riding buddies), and i've done very little work on the bike with the exception of preventative maintanence and replacing levers. Stock, the seat height is 34.3", but it can be lowered at least an inch and a half. As far as the 80 go's, the only one i've ever ridden was my '99 kx 80 and it shared alot of the same qualities of the 100. Now my 13 year old cousin has got that bike, and he loves it. By the way he's only 4'10" and the bike fits him pretty well. So in my opinion I would say

Hope this helps.

 

[Ryno149]

Sorry I accidentaly hit enter.
As I was saying, in my oppinion, GO GREEN!

 

[Jeff Sexton]

Definitely go for a bike with a power valve. If you do woods and hills, it will make a huge difference. I don't have any Suzuki experience, but I have a KX85 for my son. It's about as bullet proof as a two stroke gets. The suspension is plush and responsive and it's GREEN. What do you have against Kawasaki?

 

[Jeff Sexton]

Sorry about the "What do you have against Kawasaki?" remark. I was thinking of a different post.

 

[nephron]

Get the RM 85, and shave the seat an inch (take it to an upholsterer to have it done properly). When he's ready, put a Bill's pipe on it.

Check the recent TWMX. It's funny how they describe the RM as a great beginner bike, but the Honda as a screamer. Look at the power curves, and you will notice the RM has better power everywhere. It's not even close. Furthermore, a Bill's pipe on the RM causes that bike's curve to stretch far to the right (12,000 rpm) for peak hp--much higher than the CR's 10500 rpm peak with a pipe.

These mags are the least objective thing I've ever read. The color red seems to be a fascinoma for children; objectivity goes otd. Looking at the power curves alone, I hand it to Suzuki for building a killer motor. Looks like a great bike to me.

Also, notice that PC and FMF pipes make no difference, or COST horsepower. Wow, what a mod.... :silly: Looks like the Bill's pipe performs the best of all of them, and no one ever hears about them. Even on the CR, the Bill's appears to be the best.

 

[bishop_d]

Thanks everyone for the opinions. I think we are going to start looking at the KX. Even with a cut seat, the RM is still just too tall. It's going to be all we can do to get the KX low enough for him to ride for the first six months.

Any other ideas on dropping the seat height of an 85? Different linkage, shock mods? I can't think of anything that's not going to run $500+.

deano...

 

[ktmdad]

Double check with the KX dealer, I believe that they have different linkage arms to adjust seat height.