03 220 falls flat on top

[trev]

I ride a yz 250 and was thinking about getting a 220 for woods racing untill i rode my friends bike and it seems like after half throttle it would fall off a lot unless i pulled a higher gear. Is this common for those bikes, can I change that with a revv pipe and silencer? Or should i just de tune my yz a bit and keep it for woods racing?

 

[ridejunky]

A pipe will help some but that is the 220. Ride your bike up some really steep, rooted, wooded, rock
and leaf strewn uphills, then through some swingarm deep swamp mud. now ride the 220 thru the same. If the little green tractor doesn't garner your respect and affection there is something seriously
wrong with it. These are two different bikes built for two different purposes, ask yourself what kind of riding will you do the most. You can modify either one to help suit your needs, but remember they are
both built for different and specific purposes. good luck

 

[adam728]

The 220 is a 2 stroke designed to run like a 4 stroke tractor. It can be made to rev, but will never be like an MX bike. Whether or not you want to keep the YZ for woods racing or pick up a KDX really depends on your terrain and how serious you are. I persoanally would keep the YZ and take some steps to mellow it out (like a flywheel weight and shortened cylinder base to lower the ports and a cut head to drop compression back down). The KDX is a good machine, but is really old-school. The suspension and chassias are late 80's early 90's MX stuff. The engine needs a lot done to be turned into a rever (mine is ported, has a bored out carb, head work, plus all the normal bolts ons, and I would still call it a mild bike).

So really the question remains, what kind of terrain are you looking at riding?

 

[krazyinski]

The 220 is a 2 stroke designed to run like a 4 stroke tractor. It can be made to rev, but will never be like an MX bike. Whether or not you want to keep the YZ for woods racing or pick up a KDX really depends on your terrain and how serious you are. I persoanally would keep the YZ and take some steps to mellow it out (like a flywheel weight and shortened cylinder base to lower the ports and a cut head to drop compression back down). The KDX is a good machine, but is really old-school. The suspension and chassias are late 80's early 90's MX stuff. The engine needs a lot done to be turned into a rever (mine is ported, has a bored out carb, head work, plus all the normal bolts ons, and I would still call it a mild bike).

So really the question remains, what kind of terrain are you looking at riding?

I agree with keeping the YZ and making it a woods bike , dont agree about a full mod KDX being mild unless your comparing it to a 500cc bike on a MX track but in the woods its all about smoooth. at 25 MPH average in tight woods how much power do ya need?

 

[Green Hornet]

I have a Carb & Head Mod. along with FMF Rev/TBC2 & VF3. The bike was mild in stock form, now it is a very different animal. It is not that mild mannered anymore. I'll take my KDX over any MX Bike in the N/E Woods. Suspension is converted also

 

[adam728]

Maybe "mild" wasn't the best term. It does rip considerably harder than stock, but still is a tame beast compared to a 250 mx bike and in a straight up drag isn't too much faster than a 125.

 

[ridejunky]

The 220 isn't intended to compete in the mx arena nor is the 250 in the woods. The only bike I find comparable to the 220 for tight nasty woods with less than 50 yard straights and off camber steep up hills is the CRF 250x. Yeah you can put a bigger fly on a 250 2 stroke and "de tune" it but it will still be out of it's element compared to the 220. The 220 excels in this arena with it's torquey seamless power.

 

[KDX220R]

Yes ---my kdx falls flat on upper revs

 

[kdx633]

jet it correctly and enjoy the suprise

 

[adam728]

jet it correctly and enjoy the suprise

All the jetting in the world doesn't make up for a small carb and port timing setup for lowend power.

 

[ridejunky]

All the jetting in the world doesn't make up for a small carb and port timing setup for lowend power.

It would be impossible for this to be more correct! If your looking for a revs you will be disappointed with the KDX no matter what you do to it. I feel that trying to turn it into a rev loving screamer only yields all around mediocrity. It delivers outstanding performance in what it is engineered for,
low end torque and mid range snap.

 

[foots]

It would be impossible for this to be more correct! If your looking for a revs you will be disappointed with the KDX no matter what you do to it. I feel that trying to turn it into a rev loving screamer only yields all around mediocrity. It delivers outstanding performance in what it is engineered for,
low end torque and mid range snap.

Plus reliability and longevity would suffer

 

[kdx633]

agree'd the kdx 220 does'nt over rev like a mx'er.the point i was making is that unless you jet it right your giving up a considerable amount of top end.

 

[krazyinski]

agree'd the kdx 220 does'nt over rev like a mx'er.the point i was making is that unless you jet it right your giving up a considerable amount of top end.

I am in agreement with that. from my point of view coming off of a four stroke to the KDX it does not seam to fall flat on top end but I am used to 7 or 8 grand being the top end sooo!!! what do I know? but it is jetting sensitive. a change in needles is like getting on a new bike.

 

[adam728]

I am in agreement with that. from my point of view coming off of a four stroke to the KDX it does not seam to fall flat on top end but I am used to 7 or 8 grand being the top end sooo!!! what do I know? but it is jetting sensitive. a change in needles is like getting on a new bike.

Hate to tell you, but 7-8 grand still is your top end (it just sounds higher because a 2 stroke is firing twice as often at that speed)! The KDX200 dyno on the Just KDX site shows that even with a rev pipe, porting, headwork, and carb mod power is already falling off sharply by 8500 rpm, and the 220 signs out much earlier.

When my bike was stock I did a top speed run on my gps. Afterwards I figured out my gearing, internal gears, and tire size to find rpm. The bike ran out of revs, not power, and was screaming like it was going to blow (I really needed 7th gear ;) ), and if I remember correctly it worked out to being around 7600 rpm.

 

[krazyinski]

Hate to tell you, but 7-8 grand still is your top end (it just sounds higher because a 2 stroke is firing twice as often at that speed)! The KDX200 dyno on the Just KDX site shows that even with a rev pipe, porting, headwork, and carb mod power is already falling off sharply by 8500 rpm, and the 220 signs out much earlier.

When my bike was stock I did a top speed run on my gps. Afterwards I figured out my gearing, internal gears, and tire size to find rpm. The bike ran out of revs, not power, and was screaming like it was going to blow (I really needed 7th gear ;) ), and if I remember correctly it worked out to being around 7600 rpm.

That was (my point) why mine doesn't feel like it falls flat to me. further more every bike has a usable power band and its the skill of the rider to make that bike go smooth and fast in that power band. The goal of tuning is to get the bike to respond + perform its max in that useable power band.

 

[adam728]

That was (my point) why mine doesn't feel like it falls flat to me. further more every bike has a usable power band and its the skill of the rider to make that bike go smooth and fast in that power band. The goal of tuning is to get the bike to respond + perform its max in that useable power band.

Good point. :cool:

It's kind of like how diesels can be made screaming fast now days, even though they may never see the high side of 3200 rpm.

 

[STEVE666]

Yes my 220 has got the bigger carb, but on fast trails when you are running half throttle and you want to lift the front end over a little gulley theres nothing there at all,it seems to run out of revs. but on a tight track were you are in the bottm to mid range power its good. just wandered what sprockets you are runnig.I got a 13/48 which were on the bike when i bought it.also how much are kickstarts in the US,as i lost mine last weekend and i am having problems finding one in the UK.
CHEERS

 

[redsput]

I know it's been mentioned MANY times, but... Consider the RB carb bore, fmf dessert pipe and correct jetting (throw in a pro-lit piston for good measure.) I have an 02' and it made a world of difference. Still won't run down my 02' KX250, but in the trails/woods the KDX really shines.

 

[GabeM]

The 220 isn't intended to compete in the mx arena nor is the 250 in the woods. The only bike I find comparable to the 220 for tight nasty woods with less than 50 yard straights and off camber steep up hills is the CRF 250x. Yeah you can put a bigger fly on a 250 2 stroke and "de tune" it but it will still be out of it's element compared to the 220. The 220 excels in this arena with it's torquey seamless power.

You need to include the EXC's that KTM offers. I came off a 5-yr stint on my KDX 200, then I got my son a 220 and the power is all on the low end, this bike revs out much quicker than the 200, it just took some time to get used to running one gear higher. I rarely start his bike in 1st gear. Then I bought myself a KTM 250 EXC 2-stroke and this bike has a lot more low end that the 200, but with a huge gain in top end. Another thing you can do to the pumpkin is adjust the power valve and tell it when to come on. I haven't messed w/ this setting yet, I'm still getting used to the power. All in all, I am still on a 2-stroke and you cannot convince me yet to get on a 4-t.
When I jump on the KDX 220 from time to time, I notice how short this bike feels which is nice in extreme tight conditions, but that has to be the only place it beats the KTM.

 

[ridejunky]

Yeah, I'm sure your right but the only EXC 250 I've ridden had a recluse clutch and I
just can't seem to get used to not grabbing the lever. Thats the only thing I notice while riding it.

 

[krazyinski]

It boils down to what type and where you ride. over all the low budget high out put KDX is good to have in the garage no mater what else you like to ride. the best all around woods bike is a detuned mxer if your a competitive racer with enough guts to twist it with the big boys and have the time and money to spend. A 5'5" 160 lb guy on a fully modded KDX, can sure put it on a 6'2" 225 guy
on a KTM 300 EXC in the tight woods. but vice verse on a MX track or MORE high speed trails. Does this guy on the KDX want to get a KTM? or DOES he want to learn to ride the KDX faster? or does the guy on the KTM want a KDX or well you get the idea. hell a pro could out ride both on CRF 230 then what?