BIG problems with my KDX

[fatty_k]

Well, got the KDX torn down for the annual rebuild to find that the skirt has shattered on my 220! Last year I neglected to replace the piston with a Wiesco, and just replaced the rings. As I looked down into the crankcase, I find a nice big crack where the rod must have drove the skirt into the bottom of the case. I look underneath the engine on the out side, to find another crack, but this one dosn't correspond with the other crack! Great, I have one leaking hole in my case and another huge crack that dosnt go all the way through. I irony of this is I am awaiting a Weisco piston to install, but looks like now I will be replacing the whole bottom end as well! Please if you read this, replace your stock 220 piston with a Weisco if you havn't already, so you dont have to look at the same repair bill I will have to! Because I was one of the guys that said "pfft, that wont happen to me, just all those guys who ride their bikes really hard..." If anything good comes out of this it is that the whole top end is fine; cylinder, powervalves, head look perfect.

Fred T, dont even start... :confused:

 

[Lew]

Kyle;
Good thing you have the GG so you can still ride. To bad on the piston. With a story like that I think I may do an early swap out on my 220.
Good luck
Lew

 

[fishhead]

Ouch!

 

[Michelle]

Kyle, has the 220 had engine mods done to it? From what I've read/heard it's always been modded bikes, not stock, hence the curiosity.
Big bummer. Was the bike still running when you parked it? Just it sounds like it's not an unexpected tear-down with your comment about it being the annual td.
Cheers & sorry to read about it :(
Michelle

 

[70 marlin]

Man your a wild man! time for some JB weld?

 

[Fred T]

Originally posted by fatty_k
Fred T, dont even start... :confused: [/B]

What, and say I toldya so. Nah, I'm not that kind of guy. Sorry to hear about this. Hope the mods can keep this post up hear the top like the RB one. It's a random thing on the 220's but as you can attest it sucks to be "the one" it happens to. I changed out my piston at the end of the first year and THAT was risking it. Guys if you ride a 220 get a Wiseco piston kit, gasket kit and new wristpin bearing - $150 and rebuild it.

Fatty -post the total bill after you're done.

 

[sledman]

Maybe one of you "experienced" 220 guys can lay out the full story about 220 pistons........

 

[canyncarvr]

"pfft, that wont happen to me, just all those guys who ride their bikes really hard..."

I remember reading that. I remember thinking, 'Hhhmmmm....that doesn't sound right. Not from fatty'.

Poop! If the case(s) is/are cracked, you're just plain hosed, aren't you?

Look out fred...here comes another orange guy!!!??

re: experienced guys..full story.

The 220 pistons stink. Their skirt design is ridiculous. Inside flashing with sharp edges make it real anxious to shatter.

Well....that's the 'UNexperienced' version.

I think I read it somewhere, though....;)

BTW....the aggresively port timed, hugely-carburetted (in comparison) and superior performing kdx200 doesn't have that issue.

Yeah..it's a random thing. But as 'they' say, if it happens to you, it ain't random....it's a 100% sure thing.

yeah...keep this up top! In place of the RB thread, even. It's lost it's sense of direction anyway. THIS one, though.....READ AND HEED.

Thanks for the input, fatty. You could'a not said anything for not wanting to hear fred (or anyone else) saying, 'Told you so.'

sorry to hear it.

 

[fatty_k]

Michelle, I just have an FMF pipe/silencer, and a RAD valve for engine mods. The weird thing about this is that I didnt notice anything out of the ordinary when riding it. It ran good as always on the last ride and I didnt hear any weird noises. Im taking to the Yamaha shop that I work at to get an estimate on the price today.

canyncarvr: Im not going orange because I've already gone blue... Gas Gas EC300 blue! The 220 is now my dads ride, but I will still pay for the repairs, because it was my falult I didnt do anything about it last year.

 

[Perk]

Man that stinks. I remember hearing that a while back but had forgotten about it. Good to see again, as I have a 220 also. Still barely broken in but you never know, right?
Has Kawi acknowledged the problem at all? Sounds frequent enough to perhaps warrant a recall.

 

[Michelle]

Kyle, cheers for that. Just whenever it has been mentioned in the past, it's always been said that it's only modded 220's (as in head mods, not pipe & rad valve). Definitely a case of heads up for all 220 owners.
I know last time I read about it, I wanted to tear down the 200 to make sure all was well there (plus the fact we'd never had the head off it to see what was what in the 1-1/2 years we'd owned it). No nasty surprises, thankfully.
Seems really wierd you never noticed anything, as I'd always imagined it'd make a hell of a racket or just stop or something.
Sounds like you're a good son and hope your dad's proud of you :) Truly sorry about the bike/bill.
Michelle

 

[jsned]

Modded or not it will happen. You dont have to be riding it hard either. At one time Fredette was giving a good deal on the Wiseco kit if you mentioned you were referred to him on the DRN forum. Dont know if he still is. But I got mine for $90. complete about 2 years ago.


If you have to replace the cases and other major parts you might want to give him a call, he has a huge stock of used parts and new.

 

[fatty_k]

Thanks jsned! I will talk to him if I need some new cases.
Michelle, what I am thinking (and the mechincs think so as well) is that this happend in maybe the last 30 seconds of the last ride. Because if it would have been ridden any longer, it would have done some major damage. Im just glad I didnt warm the bike up to drain the oil! Im still kicking myself in the ass; if I wouldn't have ridden maybe 30 seconds less this whole season, all would be good!

 

[svtrb]

How soon should you change the 220 piston? Before you even ride a brand new bike or after the first year. What kind of a time frame are we looking at. I realize it depends on how much you ride. Having just purchased a 2002 and completely taking the bike apart to grease everything, replacing the fork springs and tires and now the piston needs to be replaced.

 

[fatty_k]

Well, the mechanic split the cases today and looks like I am in for a set of new cases :( The damage will be a tricky fix, if it can even be done at all. So I dont want to chance it and maybe end up having to rip it apart agian if it dosn't work, so I am just going to get new cases. They are actually remarkably cheap (compared to YZ 250 cases being $1200) at about $500 for the two cases. I think the repair bill will be around $1200 including labour. Not too bad if you ask me compared to what it could have been, but still a huge dent in my account!

 

[canyncarvr]

Wow. $500 is a big surprise (in a small way). Fer sure, more money than I have in my pocket, but less than I would have guessed.

What did fredette say?

svtrb re: how soon?

In fatty's case, maybe only 30 seconds less.

Really, now....if that's the kind of thing you're dealing with, there's no 'how soon' about it. More like if you haven't done it yet, you're already too late!

.....sez me. But then, I doan hafta worry 'bout it.

fatty:...my wife took rather large exception to your signature!! ;)
She rides a yamaha, too! Well.....a warrior. If you wanna work up a sweat, you can try keeping up with her!

 

[RTL]

Ouch... $500, that hurts.. It's a good thing you have that new ride to fall back on! Keep us posted. Merry Christmas!

 

[clevetj]

You guys have me scared to ride with all this piston talk. I guess when I have my other work done at FRP I'll order a piston kit too. My 2000 KDX220 doesn't have more than 20 hours on it but it sounds like I'm already in danger. I was thinking about one more ride before the snow flies but not anymore. Thanks for the info.

 

[70 marlin]

Buy a used 95+ kdx and sell off the parts? might get close to even.

 

[kx_693]

Does this happen to the KDX 200 at all? Just woundering since i race the GNCC's ad NAt HS and I just got my first KDX this year, i have been ridding KX 125's. IF it has ever happend or does on the 200 thenim going to get a wisco before I go to FL. thanks guys

 

[fatty_k]

No problem with the 200, only 220's.

 

[Canadian Dave]

If I lived in the US and had the choice between a KDX200 or 220 I'd be all over the 200. Here in Canada we only get the 220 so I don't have a choice between the two.

A 220 offers slightly more displacement and a 2mm smaller carb for better bottom end throttle response and is more luggable than the 200 plus it has an o-ring chain. For that Kawasaki changes an extra $400. If I had the choice I'd save the $400 and pick up a 200 and use the $400 I saved to build a better bike. How? Its easy. A good quality o-ring chain runs about $75, one of Eric Gorr's 225cc big bore kits is $400 and I’d save $50 to $75 on a carb bore because the 200 is already equipped with a 2mm larger carb so my total investment would be the same. Once everything was said and done I'd have a 225cc top end ported for mo-better power, a top end gasket kit and Wiseco piston for $400, no worries about cracking a stock 220 piston here, more power than either a stock 200 or 220 that's easier to use, better quality cylinder coating than stock, a larger carb, and I'd have a brand new 200 piston and rings left over that I could easily sell for enough to pay for new fork springs. The difference in cost between the modified 200 and 220? $0 and I'd have a better bike.

As an added bonus the 200's transfer port angles are better suited to smooth power delivery so once its enlarged and ported the final results are better than you could achieve with the 220 cylinder.

As for way the 220 piston cracks while the 200 piston is as durable as they come, you've got me. I can tell you that the material below the wrist pin is thinner on the 220 piston and that could well be the problem. When replacing the stock 220 piston you'll want to pick up a Wiseco piston as apposed to a stock 220 replacement piston or a Pro-X piston as they are both made by the same piston manufacture. Pro-X buys surplus pistons, sorts them by size and resells them.

Oh and Kyle if you're looking for an as new 220 piston with rings give me a call :( I've got them sitting here in a box, a Wiseco box that is.

 

[fatty_k]

Dave, I just got my Wiseco kit in from the shop (yamaha) I work at for really cheap. I just got the standard 69mm piston, yet I have a "B" cylinder. The mechanics say it will fit and work just fine. Any comments on this? Thanks for the offer though. Do you happen to have any 220 cases by any chance?

 

[Canadian Dave]

Sorry no cases. When you search for cases either the 200 or 220 cases will work as long as they are 1995+. If you get stuck consider calling Jeff Fredette, he might have some used ones on hand or know where you can get some.

Yes your mechanic is right it will work just fine.

David

 

[fatty_k]

I e-mailed Jeff. Said that he has some cases but another guy might buy them. He said $200 US for them, which is basically what I can get them for anyways from the shop.