crf 450 negatives?

[mx547]

i'm getting a new '03. i am presently injured, so i have plenty of time to think about it. i will either get the cr250 two-stroke or the crf450. i know enough about the 250's as i have been riding them forever. i know enough about the positives on the 450 and i have spent some time on a '02 but what i want to know is what are the negatives? be honest. no gloss. this is alot of money to spend and a tough decision. if i can't get straightforward answers then i'll just stick with what i know. thanks.

p.s. please don't recite mxa tests. i want real-world info.

 

[BillyWho]

My only complaint on the bike is the foot peg packs with dirt too easy and sticks up at a 45 degree angle. Honestly thats my biggest lame gripe on it. I do have the 20mm offset RG3 clamps and suspension, pro circuit pipe, and got fastway low boy foot pegs which fixed the problem of the pegs. I really love everything about the bike, it has that typical Honda "race" feel to it which I didn't have on the Yamaha. It's a little more bike than the CR250, but you don't have to use all of it if you don't want too, I think it would work well for all skill levels.

 

[Wolf]

Did they ever sort out the airbox/filter problems?

 

[smarttoys]

I just got my '03 CRF450 and I like it so far. The negatives that are the most obvious are that it doesn't steer as precisely as my '02 YZ250 and it feels heavy when jumping and cornering. I'm 6'2" and the layout of the bike is a little cramped but no worse than my YZ. I will need some more time to get the CRF set up better for myself.

The suspension felt great, better than my revalved YZ250. The power is good but I definitely need to get used to the 4-stroke power delivery. My YZ250 accelerates harder/ faster.

I got the CRF450 for a play bike. I will probably use my YZ for racing.

 

[bclapham]

Jay: You might want to check the eric gorr write up on top end and valve care. It seems the CRF has less negatives than the YZF as far as top end parts costs etc. not a comparison to 2 strokes but important all the same.

the interesting feedback is that lots of people think a 4-stroke is maintainance free, however, if you buy it and ride it and dont keep ontop of valve adjustment things can get ugly very quicky. look up the post, its a good read...even for 2 stroke owners!

good luck, but between a cr and a crf i dont think you can go wrong on either!

 

[johntt]

The 2-stroke yz250 might hit harder and "feel" faster, but it's not.There is not agap in the 450 powerband, therefore no hit. I've owned about 8 250's and they aren't faster/quicker.

 

[crkid]

I agree with john, it may not feel as fast, but it is.

 

[Okiewan]

No doubt, it's faster than it feels. I overshot several corners and over jumped stuff the first time out on one.

 

[chumbucket]

All this talk about the crf is making me want one.

 

[biglou]

A couple of coments from the peanut gallery here: I rode David's at Badlands and agree that it is "sneaky fast", meaning that it doesn't hit like the 426, but has a very linear torque curve. Smooth accelleration. You'll be going faster than you realize since you don't get that "I just got rear-ended by a semi" feeling.

Also, didn't I read in here where they sorted out the steering geometry for '03? That was the biggest complaint I have heard about the '02, but the new ones are supposed to be tweaked to take care of that, ie: Non garbage scow handling! :D

 

[mx547]

i'm more concerned about the general maintenance (as my bud bclapham referred to) and starting issues, that sort of thing. seems that i hear about alot of people grenading four-strokes, i never have that problem with two-strokes. i know the handling and the power suits me fine.
i was kinda shocked when i read about the "garbage scow" handling. it really didn't feel much different than my 250 to me. maybe my 250 handles like a garbage scow too and i just don't realize it. thanks mxa for enlightening me.

 

[rockchucker]

mx547,

Ergonomics were an issue for me. I came off a YZF250 so this bike felt long and kinda squatty. I'm used to a more upright/forward riding position. I probably have my sag set too low on my CRF. Anyway the pegs are in a weird position and the bike tends to pull you down and back on hard landings. I haven't experimented with the aftermarket pegs but I'm sure the 03's will be different. Seriously though, it's a good bike with little issues. Mine burned oil like crazy when I first got it. In reality it still does but only if it's synthetic. You'll be happy with the 03.

 

[bclapham]

MX547:

read this:

http://www.dirtrider.net/forums3/showthread.php?threadid=53569

if i had the choice i would go for the CRF, the bandwagon is rolling and you just have to decide when to get on! I have read the suspension forums with quite some interest, and on many occassions it appears the 4-stroke is easier to set up and ride. And if the mags are true the CRF is a good starter.

As far as reliablity, its all about the mindset...people are used to XR250's where you do the oil once a year and ride it for the other 364 days and people think you can do the same with a YZF or CRF, you cant! (sorry to plagiarise on that one).

I will make an analogy with golf here........ and probably get flamed!

4-strokes can be compared to the Big Betha drivers, in the hands of an expert (Tiger or Ferry) they really give out big power and can be put to use, but for the average Joe, they can really help you get distance down the fairway or those big straight aways and jumps, thus giving confidence and adding to the enjoyment!

Its kinda ironic that they wanted to ban them Big Bertha drivers, but now you will hardly see a wooden club on a golf course.......how many 2-strokes will be left at the tracks in 5 years?

i have nothing to base this on apart what i can see at the local tracks, it just my opinion so dont flame me!

btw, i ride a yz250 2stroke and i am a beginner (at MX anyway) so i wonder if trying to hold on to it is making me think the grass is greener........ :)

 

[Antman]

Starting is a non issue once you adjust the decompression. I kick firmly while seated and it starts 1st kick 95% of the time. As for maintenance, the only thing different is I change oil more often (every other ride) and I check the valves periodically. Once when I first bought it(the exhausts were tight and I shimmed appropriately) and at 70 hours (they were still within spec). Suspension, chain, and chassis lubrication are the same as a two stroke. I wear out my rear tire pretty fast, but I started using a 120 and that seems to last longer. I probably would spend less time on a CR250 because you have to change oil in the tranny and the engine. The drains are both on the left side. I don't have to clean the power valve and mix gas anymore. I did a top end at 70 hours and all was in spec and I will not do it that soon again. I'll wait for 100 next time. I did fix the airbox with a pc racing kit. The '03 airbox addresses all the deficiencies of the 02 airbox. The CRF is heavier, but not much. The vibration of a 2 stroke wears me out much quicker than the weight of the 450.

 

[bclapham]

the 2 oil plugs is an issue i heard about, the two different stoires were wrong oil in the wrong reservoir and the other story was two lots of oil in one reservoir and none in the other, very costly mistakes! i dont think it is a matter of incompetance rather than it sounds very easy to confuse the two, i dont know how many times ive forgotten to tighten something because of interuptions etc.....but i suppose once youve heard these stories you will remember better!

 

[MxKid512]

the 2 oil plugs is an issue i heard about, the two different stoires were wrong oil in the wrong reservoir and the other story was two lots of oil in one reservoir and none in the other, very costly mistakes!

There is no excuse for that. Thats like saying,"I forgot the tranny oil in my 2 stroke" Or, "I accidently mixed up the gear lube and the premix oils" That to me is ridiculous. Read the manual and after the first few changes It'll become so routine you wouldn't even think twice about it.

 

[smarttoys]

The 2-stroke yz250 might hit harder and "feel" faster, but it's not.There is not agap in the 450 powerband, therefore no hit. I've owned about 8 250's and they aren't faster/quicker

I may have forgotten to mention that I have a big bore kit and porting on my YZ. Corners definitely come up faster on my YZ. So yes, it accellerates faster/quicker corner to corner. On tighter tracks, I am faster corner to corner on the YZ250 compared to my CRF450. Part of that is the quicker handling and the other part is that my YZ just accelerates very hard. Much faster than stock (and also wears me out faster than a stock 250). In comparison I think the CRF is faster than a stock 250 2-stroke.

These are my observations and may not represent the observations of others. :confused:

Just for curiosity, I'm going to run the two bikes on the dyno and see how they compare in terms of rear wheel HP. That only tells you so much but it would still be interesting to see. Unfortunately, I will have to wait until fall when I have more time to play.

 

[motometal]

One of the main reasons I ride is to "FEEL THE POWER". I want it to hit hard! "you are going way faster than you think you are" doesn't do me any good, it's actually more dangerous! Wimpy "electric motor" powerbands are a bummer, but that's just my opinion...

1985 CR500...now there's a motor!

 

[mark_england]

not much engine breaking (this may be good if you a 2 stroke rider)
Bit of a buzz through the bars
If its dumped when hot i personally think the YZF is easier to start (tho not as easy as a KTM with a button)
Also the engine doesnt feel as refined as the YZF.

(all this said though the only thing that really put me off this bike was the lack of engine breaking)

 

[Smitty]

So far I love the lack of engine Breaking. :)

 

[TOTALL]

i agree with chumbucket

 

[geremacheks]

For maintenance, adjusting the valves was mentioned. How difficult is this to do on the 450? Compared to......something else?

And doing the top end? I don't know if I should even ask about that.......difficult?

 

[Sawblade]

MX547 - Have you made a decision on what to buy yet?

 

[Antman]

Checking the valves is as easy as making sure the engine is Top Dead Center (TDC) and using feeler gauges. If the valves are out of spec, usually too tight, you pull off the cam block 6 bolts including the cam gear and hang the gear and chain on the frame with a wire or zip tie. The shims are accessible on top of each valve. You can use a magnet to remove them. There is a number on top of each shim. These are the metric sizes. You can either replace the shims that are too tight with the appropriate replacement from Honda, or lap the shims to the proper spec with sandpaper and plate glass. Actually, Suzuki GSXR shims work as well. The owners manual shows how to do this very well.

 

[Rich Rohrich]

Originally posted by Antman
or lap the shims to the proper spec with sandpaper and plate glass.

Only the truly desperate or foolish would attempt something like this.