It depends on sales mostly. The manufacturers will make what sells. Even if two-strokes became closed-course-only, if they still sold sufficient numbers, the manufacturers would still produce them unless they became completely illegal for anything. On the flip side, if four-strokes become big sellers and two-stroke sales decrease very much, the manufacturers would produce what people buy, and would not spend money engineering and making both. Profits will determine the future of our bikes until they are banned completely. And in pro racing, only the YZ 250 F has really been succesfull, four-strokes have only won a small number of races in the 250 class, and haven't really become the chosen ride yet. After all the fuss about the "unfairness" of the YZ 400/426 F, it certainly didn't dominate races at all.
Here's the grim proposal. Its interesting with whats facing our country right now parts of our governing body see this as a priority:
Wednesday September 19 6:24 PM ET
EPA Orders Cut in Snowmobile, Boat, ATV Emissions
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Environmental Protection Agency (news - web
sites) on Wednesday proposed to curb emissions from snowmobiles,
diesel-powered boats, off-road motorcycles and all-terrain vehicles to help
reduce pollution, especially in national parks.
New limits will be established for carbon monoxide and nitrogen oxides
emitted by the engines, the EPA said.
``If left unregulated, pollution from these sources will continue to
increase, becoming a larger part of the overall mobile source pollution,''
EPA Administrator Christine Todd Whitman (news - web sites) said in
``This action will not only protect public health, but will help to restore
the view of our nation's treasured scenic parks and wilderness areas,'' she
The variety of engines and vehicles covered by the EPA plan account for
roughly 13 percent of mobile source hydrocarbon emissions.
The new limits would cut the vehicles' carbon monoxide emissions up to 56
percent and nitrogen oxides up to nearly 80 percent, the EPA said.
Environmental groups have long sought stricter standards for the more than
1.6 million snowmobiles used by Americans for winter recreation. The
machines are permitted in more than two dozen national parks, including
Yellowstone National Park and Voyageurs National Park.
Some green groups contend that one hour on a single snowmobile emits roughly as much hydrocarbon pollution as driving a car for a year. They also say that snowmobiles used near the Old Faithful geyser create more pollution in a weekend than a year's worth of automobile traffic through the park.
The EPA began preparing a proposal to limit emissions of snowmobiles several
years ago after Congress ordered it to study the pollution produced by
engines of all kinds. The agency faced a court-ordered deadline of September
14, 2001 to issue a proposed rule.
The EPA plan for snowmobiles would require a 30 percent cut in emissions by
2006 and by 50 percent by 2010.
Manufacturers of snowmobiles had sought a lengthy phase-in period for new
curbs on emissions, saying time was needed to develop cleaner engines. The
companies say they spend millions of dollars annually on new technology and
the use of ethanol to help curb emissions.
The stricter emission limits proposed by the EPA include the following:
+ Snowmobiles will have to cut hydrocarbon and carbon monoxide emissions by 30 percent in 2006 and by 50 percent in 2010.
+ Heavy, non-road machinery engines will adopt a standard in 2004 already
set by California several years ago. The standard will be further tightened
+ Recreational boats' diesel engines will adopt the same standards already
applied to commercial marine engines, with two years of extra time for
manufacturers to adapt emissions control technology.
+ Off-road motorcycles and all-terrain vehicles will be ''encouraged'' to
switch from two-stroke engines to four-stroke engines in 2006. In addition,
all-terrain vehicles would also need to meet a stricter limit beginning in
Public hearings will be held in Washington on October 24, and in Denver,
Colorado, on October 30 on the new proposal.
The EPA also said it planned to issue a proposal to restrict emissions for
motorcycles used on highways and gasoline-power pleasure boats within the
next few months.
The agency has already adopted stricter emission standards for personal
watercraft such as Jet Skis that will go into effect in 2006.
You can submit comments regarding the proposal to tighten OHV emissions
standards to mailto:NRANPRM@epa.gov. More indepth details on proposal at http://www.epa.gov/otaq/recveh.htm
i heard 2008 too, but u know what i would like to ride a 4-stroke mxer like a yz250f, but i still like my yz125 but i just dont like the idea of it being this way, id just buy a 2007 whene they come out and keep it, but than ill change over to 4-strokes
If they do in fact quit making 2-strokes, here's what I'm going to do: I'm going to buy 2 250's the last model year (RM, KX, CR, or YZ depending on what I like). I'm going to ride one and disassemble the other and store it. I'll either sell it later or put it together if I'm not too old and have the last best reasonably priced funnest toy ever made for overgrown children like myself. Long live the 2-stroke 250!!!:cool:
If the Democrats get the white house again the answer is yes!And the EPA
is the wackiest agency in the world.Some of the regulations they put on
people and businesses are shear communism.Just let them try and stop me
from riding my 2 stroke,it'll NEVER happen.I like the idea one guy had where
we buy 2 of the last model year 2 strokes.Count me in,and I'll ride it till the
day I die.The only way they will get me to stop riding them is to pry my cold
dead hands off the handlebars!People, we've got to stand up to this kind of
crap,this is American we live in-not Russia!
Now if they stop making them because they don't sell then that is another
The epa will never ban the use of two strokes, they will just stop news ones from being made. They will suffer a slow death just like two stroke street bikes did in the early eighties. All is not lost though. Now that emmisions targets have been set mfgs may begin to look into clean two strokes. Polaris, Skidoo and Artic cat all have clean two strokes in the works. Think of the marketing advantage one company would have if they were the only ones to have a cleen two stroke.BTW I have heard rumors that Honda has had clean two strokes for some time.
2007/8/9? I have a funny feeling that we'll have enough technology at that time to make a clean, efficient engine that is better by far, than today's. I think that this shift will encourage new engine technology, that's good. Who knows, maybe by that time there will be an powerful electric engine you can "render" to make it feel like the old 2-strokes of 2001. I'm not worried.......
No. Period. No. Just no. No. Do hear what Im sayin? No. Nope. Notta. No.
My reasoning: why would they? I could see it in streetbikes and CARS. But there arent enought 2-strokes in the entire world that could make enough pollution to overpower all of the 4-STROKE AUTOMOBILES! Think about it... How many of you drive to work or school by yourself everyday, in your own car, truck or whatever. Now just look out the window at the parking lot... see all those cars out there? Imagine if 1/2 of those cars carried 2 people to work instead of one. There would be a HUGE difference in the amount of cars. Now what if everyone drove a van and carried SIX people to work, how many cars would you see out there then? If they really want to get somewhere with pollution, they would do something about the number of cars. But since we live in America, it wont happen anytime soon, and it most likely will never happen at all.
Now, I want to make another point clear. How many weedeaters out there do you see with a 5hp Briggs & Straton engine strapped to it? Can you imagine the weight of that thing? Same thing with chain saws! They are already heavy enough, and Im sure there is plenty of 4-strokers, but just think about it here. Anything you see out there that has a 2-stroke engine has it for a REASON. They wouldnt just go and make something that pollutes the air twice as bad or worse than a 4-stroke for the hell of it now would they?
Plus, they wont be able to shut them down for closed course use. The manufacturers have control over that like Spanky said. So even if they dont ban 2-strokes, the manufacturers can stop production of them if they think the 4-strokes sell better and arent making any profit on the 2-strokes.
Im sure I could think of some more, but Im sure youre already tired of reading my post.:) Congrats if youve read all this, I dont think I could.:eek:
Screw the tree hunging owl f#@^%ers 2 strokes rule. They are much more fun to ride easier to maintain and cheaper. I HOPE THEY NEVER STOP BUILDING 2 STROKES. FOUR STROKES ARE A FAD AND WILL NOT LAST. There are not enough 2 stroke dirt bikes to pollute the air. Four strokes suck.
This epa stuff just kills me, here in the states we are mandated about bikes that are used for a minimal amount of hours compared to cars, yet they feel these bikes threaten the environment..hello! Also, what's it matter if our country is so strict, doesn't the whole earth need to follow the same rules or it is fruitless?? Just because we are not creating as much pollution as 10years ago, doesn't mean that the bad air from another region is not floating our way. Just doesn't make sense. In Japan, you can still buy a street legal 2stroke, here, they want to make it impossible to buy a 2stroke dirt bike. Come on, there are bigger issues than what a 2stroke dirt bike produces, let's get the big businesses/factories and leave our favorite play toys alone.
I doubt it will ever happen. I do believe that manufacturers will stop producing them eventually. I have thought about going to a four stroke, I'm just not ready, might not ever be. If I'm not ready then I'll invest in two-three two strokes, riding one until its worn out then moving to the next etc. The question is will you still be allowed to ride them?:think
I have to disagree. The bike companies see the writing on the wall. They know they will be forced to go thumper. That's why the tide is turning.
It is not a fad.
As for your second point, it's not just air pollution, its also water and soil pollution. Yes a clean running two stroke is fine. But how many times have you seen Splooge dripping from a tailpipe? We all have. Remember, one DROP of motor oil is detectable in 1,000 gallons of water. (Read it won't pass EPA standards for YOU to drink). Have you seen oil on the trail from a improperly jetted bike or old packing in a silencer? I have and so have the eco-freaks. This is part of the the problem. As far as the "Not enough two strokes to pollute the air" any clue on how many more emissions are generated by a pre mixer as compared to a Thumper engine? Look it up.
No I don't want smokers banned and I am not a tree hugger, but I'm also smart enough to figure it out. We have to make concessions on both sides. We have to be smart. We have to be proactive.
As for your last "enlightend" statement, You may want to rethink a little, because those sucky fourstrokes may be your only choice.
Sorry guys, but there is a WORLD outside the States. Environmental regulations have been applied, but mostly from the Motorcycle Associations themselves. This means regulations are down to earth, and actually have a real benefit for the environment.
Noise: 92 Db max, so rule out all those YZF
Tires: 13mm maximum tread
Actually I have and I really did'nt like it. It had good power no complaints there, I just did'nt like the feel or the noise! But then again I have been riding 2 strokes for years. I am also not a big Yamaha fan maybe I might like the new cr450f better but I doubt it
Rodzilla I actually agree with you I am just hoping 4 strokes are just a fad. And I wanted to stir up trouble
I also fish alot and the epa is hitting outboards the same way. The newer outboards with fuel injection I am told meet emissions standards. If the amount of emitted from 2 stroke exhaust was that big a problem I don't think there would be a fish alive.
Guaryzzzpeople 92 Db may be correct from the factory but most YZF's have aftermarket exhaust that blast your ear drums
In the past two years I have twice traveled to the country of India where there is a large number of two stroke scooters and rickshaws, and let me tell you the EPA in this country is a good thing a very good thing.
Today's four strokes are great bikes and are only getting better. After visiting New Delhi or Bombay and seeing the pollution there I believe most of you would be glade to give up your two strokes for a four stroke.