Help Jeremy- 01 rm 250 bottoming

[brentl]

sorry for the spacing thought I typed more spaces in but the twu columns are correct:

comp reb

40x.2 (8) 36x.2 (6)
30x.1 28x.1
28x.1 36x.3
38x.25 34x.3
36x.25 32x.3
34x.25 30x.3
32x.25 28x.3
30x.25 26x.3
28x.25 24x.3
26x.25 22x.3
24x.25
22x.3

 

[Jeff Howe]

One of the immutable laws of marketing states that it is huge mistake to try to own the connection of a industry leader. By that I mean, that forever and a day, Race Tech has "owned" the terms "high flow" in the prospects minds. Everybody knows Race Tech for that concept or idea. So it's a huge mistake for Moto Pro to try to get people to associate that with themselves when it's Race Tech that is known for that. It just don't work out. It's a segment or niche, that RT created for themselves years and years ago, and it has been their's forever. Moto Pro will fail with that. They need to find their own niche or segment to be successful marketing their products. They will never get into the prospects mind as the king of high flow.

 

[HONDA65]

In case you didn't know, Moto Pro used to be a Race Tech Center, the largest in the US, according to their old ads. But a couple of years ago they got the idea to copy (with some changes of course) the GV's. Needless to say they are not on RT's Christmas list anymore. In fact the last time I mentioned them to someone at RT, the phrase was F*** that guy!! They obviously were not happy about them copying their design, but I assume its different enough to head off any lawsuits.

But I guess he has a good following in the Seattle area, so maybe he has his niche there.

 

[Jeff Howe]

nothing they can do about it. There is no patent on the design, only the name is trademarked. And the design is different anyway. It don't matter though. RT is king in high flow, if thats what you want. I really don't think Thede has much to worry about there. I could be wrong but as established as RT is I highly doubt it.

 

[marcusgunby]

Shaggy that assister spring just looks so 70s-i wouldnt dare fit one on a modern bike.

 

[Jeremy Wilkey]

Originally posted by HONDA65


As for their thinking on the new valve, I would assume that with larger ports and a 24mm shim that deflects easier, you would have a plusher ride.

And for whatever its worth, I believe these were developed with Ty Davis. He originally was taking KTM GV's, which uses the 24mm shims to begin with and was modifing them for his Yamaha's

The new Honda's (Showas) seem to be following this aproach. their port volume makes a GV look like a pin hole. And yes, they do use ALOT of shims. But they seem to be working pretty well. Hey, whats a few extra nano-ounces?

I allways find it intresting that no one ever really thinks about what the valve is for.. We allways argue about high flow low flow or something inbettween. We talk about area and levarage but we don't really look at how that relates to fluid flow.

A valve is a variable orfice. The more effecent that orfice is at changeing its area, based on flow requirments, the better your suspenesion works. The Large valve face is no diferent than a smaller one if the same pviot to od ratio is mantained all things being equal. (Although it does get softer without piston lands.) What it does do is create a more stable seal, greater area for flow, and criticaly a more tunable stack. Rember we want to have maximum tunablity with the fewest posible number of shims. Our general case is we have OD's in 1mm incroments and thinkness of .05 >.1mm so with smaller valve its quite easy to be somewhere off the scale even with our nearly infenient combinations of shims. With a biger piston on the basevalve we can create a tunable system where one incroment of change has less overall impact, and this mmakes the job much easier. Also and I belive this to be a very important aspect, the lag of the system can be reduced. In other words the Check valve can close more quickly with less overall defelction. Also the shims canhave less sealing area and equal stablity.

One other thing, somewhere if ot this thread RT was given credit for the invention of the aftermarket basevalve.. No way..... Simmons was the first almost years before RT.. Eric Gorr I think knowes the name of sombody in Europe long before him too... Manytime the orginators of a concept don't get the credit they deserve..

BR,
Jer