Using the 'off topic' forum... (a gripe)

[NGE]

OK, I just have to ask.... what is the purpose of this forum?

I know that this used to be the "flame" forum, and was changed to "off topic"... Not sure why exactly, but my guess was to alleviate people thinking it was their place to go off, but still allow an area for discussion of 'other' topics.

Is the subject matter limited? (if so you should indicate the limitations somewhere obvious... and reprimand the poster, not the ones who reply... or both, if neccesary)

Can we only discuss what we know everyone will agree with?

Is it accepted practice for moderators to insult one party in a debate (the one they don't agree with) and then lock the threads?

Are 'differences of opinion' reason to close the thread? (there were no insults flying... I simply stated a fact that apparently the moderator didn't agree with...) My response was not at all 'stupid' as the moderator commented, and certainly did not contain any false or harmfull information.

I will certainly follow the rules to the best of my ability, and will gladly suffer the consequences if I fail, but I need to know what they are (and so do the others).. because it is clearly not adventageous to an 'open forum of discussion' for certain veiwpoints to be allowed and others to be insulted and then censored by the moderators (considering, of course, that the comments aren't beyond what you, as an organization, find acceptable)....

I realize that this is a privately held forum, and you can run it how you see fit... I have no 'right' to post anything here and it is only by your graces that I am able to enjoy the things I do about this site... much more than I don't BTW...

maybe my views are entirely too independant for the bulk of your readers and you choose to spare them? maybe you only want comments that you can agree with? maybe you want to limit my posts to "technical' issues? maybe you want to limit me from using the 'off topic' forum because my oppinons differ from the others there?.. maybe you think I'm just trying to 'start issues'? (I'm not).... maybe I should accept that the moderators are allowed to do whatever they want?... maybe there is limits on 'controvertial statements'?... maybe I'm out of line for publicly admonishing a moderator? (I have no other way to contact anyone) ANY of that is well within your rights... But I can't follow rules I don't know!!! And it seems quite biased to allow certain political statements and then censor the replies (although clearly within your right)....

Give me the answers to these questions and I will retain them for futher refference and try to abide by them in the future (or decide that I cannot accept them and leave... either way, it's solved)... If I fail to do so, ask me to leave and I'm gone... if not, ban me... but please at least make it clear what the limitations are... and point to me what exactly I did wrong if you expect me to change... or you can just ban me now for even confronting this issue :yikes: (I hope not)

 

[JasonWho]

Back To The Front!

 

[Jaybird]

The "Off Topic" forum has always been the Off Topic forum, and has never been the "Flame" Forum.
Something you "Knew" to be fact, that in reality, isn't a fact at all.

Have you read the FAQ's?

There is a forum for political statements and responses. Can't get to it? Anti up.

Truespode did the best thing he could do in the situation that has you all in a tizzy this time. And for the record, I agree with his statement 100%. BTW...that same statement could have been made to you many times over in the past couple of weeks, in several different forums.

Just because something is a "Fact" or a "True Statement" in your mind, doesn't make it so.
Being a moderator on another board may have you thinking you are correct in everything you post, but around here we prefer to see some real facts and references to such, as opposed to opinionated drivel.

 

[Chili]

The off topic forum is for anything "off topic" for the other forums. The thread that Ivan closed he did as a courtesy to save you from the brunt of what was coming your way. For the record I agree with Ivan that the post was Ignorant.

 

[BSWIFT]

Is the subject matter limited?

Yes.

Are 'differences of opinion' reason to close the thread? (there were no insults flying... I simply stated a fact that apparently the moderator didn't agree with...) My response was not at all 'stupid' as the moderator commented, and certainly did not contain any false or harmfull information.

No, facts or not, making a political statement that will stir up contoversy is not what this site is about. There are plenty of other BB that will allow and tolerate that type of discussion.

I realize that this is a privately held forum, and you can run it how you see fit... I have no 'right' to post anything here and it is only by your graces that I am able to enjoy the things I do about this site... much more than I don't BTW...

We are happy to have you. :)

maybe my views are entirely too independant for the bulk of your readers and you choose to spare them? maybe you only want comments that you can agree with?

Not true, we just limit the discussion. We can always agree to disagree. The problem is that things get out of hand quickly, so, the moderators will close posts quickly to prevent the inevitable trashing that WILL lead to members being banned. It has happened and is dealt with promptly, period.

maybe I'm out of line for publicly admonishing a moderator? (I have no other way to contact anyone) ANY of that is well within your rights

Not advisible to admonish a moderator without respecting the job that they perform for free and they do follow certain quidelines in moderating the forums. You can contact a moderator by clicking on their Avatar and sending them an email or become a subscriber and gain access to PM's and other perks. However, being a subscriber or STM does not change the rules but it does have some forums that allow a bit of leaneancy in subject matter.

 

[Neil Wig]

Thanks Bswift, after reading the cause of this post, I was kind of at a loss as to why it was closed.

I see your point. The comment, regardless of weather you agree or disagree, was going to draw a rapid and raw response.

HOWEVER, by your own yardstick, shouldn't the original post have been cause for closing the thread? Is it only inflamitory if someone disagrees? If all had followed like sheep and agreed with the gist of the initial post, would it still be active??

The comments at the bottom of the initial post are every bit as inflamitory as the response they generated.

Later

 

[BSWIFT]

The comments at the bottom of the initial post are every bit as inflamitory as the response they generated.

My response, "The problem is that things get out of hand quickly, so, the moderators will close posts quickly to prevent the inevitable trashing". Thanks for making the point more poiniant.
PS, the yardstick is not mine. :nener: :bang: :cool:

 

[NGE]

Jason, I'm not trying to start anything... but I am getting sick of seeing the moderators put in quip little insults and closing the thread.... This has happned before, bu the last time I brought it on myself with an insult that was somewhat uncalled for... (I didn't mean to sound so mean, but realize that I did anyways)...

Jaybird, I've given up listening to your emotional and biased oppinion...

Chili, I fail to see what is 'ignorant' about that post... Perhaps you disagree with my statement, but it is certainly not ignorant.... but you are certainly entitled to your views... (so am I)

BSWIFT, thanks for the thoughtfull reply

"No, facts or not, making a political statement that will stir up contoversy is not what this site is about."

that is all good with me, but I didn't start the thread about this issue, I just replied.... if that type of issue isn't welcome, I should not be admonished for it, the poster should... and the proper course of action should be to just shut down the thread if someone thinks it might be headed in the wrong direction... (not toss out a round of childish insults and THEN close the thread)

I have tried to contact a moderator in a different method... none of them seem to work for a 'registered' user.... I know who closed the thread, and would have repectfully brought my complaint straight to them, if I had the opportunity.... I know that moderating is largely subjective, and that it is not an easy job all the time.... I respect their (your?) right to run things how they please, even if I don't think it's right.... I just want to know the rules so I don't break them... (oh, and I think they do a great job regardless of this difference and I know that the forums would not be possible without them :worship: )

I understand why this forum would not want such discussions going on, it is a dirtbike forum after all.... I would never have started such a conversation, but I figured it was o.k. to reply (again, I didn't insult anyone, or anything like that)

I will keep this all in mind in the future.... maybe it will keep me out of trouble

 

[NGE]

shouldn't the original post have been cause for closing the thread? Is it only inflamitory if someone disagrees? If all had followed like sheep and agreed with the gist of the initial post, would it still be active??

The comments at the bottom of the initial post are every bit as inflamitory as the response they generated.

THAT is my point.... not that it was closed, but that it is only closed (and I am admonished) when I reply... (rather courteously considering)

(in BSWIFT's (and the moderator in questions) deffense- it should be noted that I got into a childish pissing match in this forum before... so some of what I see as this 'over reaction' is my own fault... but I thought I was following the rules this time... :( ... understandably, the rules may apply a little more to me than some others, until I hopefully live it down, because of this)

Thanks for making the point more poiniant.

that explains why it would be closed.... it does not explain the moderators comments before closing...

Regardless, I'll keep an eye on what I say on here (thought I was doing that... lol).. because I sure do like the place for dirtbike info.. :clue: .... and there are far more appropraite places to discuss the other things I guess...

thanks again for the input

 

[BSWIFT]

it does not explain the moderators comments before closing

I have no explanation for that and don't think an explanation will be given by the moderator. This is just a case for letting "it" go. I've had threads or posts locked or deleted. It is a judgement call, like it or not, simple done deal. BTW, I am purposely staying as neutral as possible. My answers to your questions may not reflect the other moderators view points. My responses are "my take" on "my" moderator duties. The admins can clearify further if they see fit but this subject has been addressed many, many times. I have no moderator duties in this forum so my points or lack there of are just my view point based on past experience with the same questions from other members. I hope that I have been helpful but if not, sorry.:moon:

 

[Okiewan]

Moderator's "duties" and the guidelines used aren't open for discussion. As their responsibilities are NOT black and white and involve judgement calls by individuals, putting these up for debate is nothing more than opening a huge can of worms. When one is on the "outside looking in" it's very easy to pick points apart and debate the attitudes and opinions of the moderators/admins endlessly. We have spent the last 5 years figuring out how to walk the line of moderation and will continue to learn, always with the best interest of the members in mind.

 

[truespode]

This one is being closed to.

NGE, if you don't like it... I don't care... leave if it bothers you so much.

You only post to cause trouble. That is evident by how you have hovered over this thread and have replied to almost every response. Responding like that is the mark of a troll. I do not like trolls, do not tolerate trolling and will close trolling posts.

You seem to think there is a conspiracy about why the original post wasn't closed after it was posted. I'll give you a hint. I did not see it. Despite what you may think we do not watch every forum 24 hours a day. We sometimes do not read a post for the 1st time until after there are 9, 10 or sometimes 20 or more replies.

No conspiracy, just the facts of how much time we have.

Do ME a favor and go away. I am not going to ban you. I will close posts of yours that are definately trolling (and the definition of that is going to be based on MY judgement). If you want to stay I have no control over that as I do not ban members.

However, my personal feelings is that if you were gone it would be a good thing. I do not respect your thought process and I do not think you are as intelligent as you like to believe. However, I keep my personal opinions to myself mostly unless questioned (which is basically why you started this thread).

So, now you have a choice to make. Stay and stop trolling for attention or leave (which I prefer).

Also, this was always the off-topic forum and never was the flame forum. Your assumptions as to what happens around here is wrong (again).

As for us making quips and closing threads... it is b/c we are going to get the last word and let you worry about it on your own time. We are not going to argue about it. You made your point with your initial post... I am replying. No need for further comment after that. Both sides have been represented.

To further the thread would only be to further your stupid game and trolling.

Also for the record my personal e-mail is truespode at yahoo.com You have never contacted me with questions about the thread but you know what... a lot of people have sent me e-mails saying thanks for closing it b/c they knew they would have replied in a way that would not have been appropriate.

Have a good day and don't forget that I really would like you to leave.

Ivan

 

[truespode]

PS... I'm the tolerant one.