KDX200H what weight fork oil?

[Joburble]

Hi all,
I have just done the shim stack mod on my standard forks (KDX200H) and bought Elf fully synthetic 5wt fork oil for it. The service manual says 5wt but the fork is now a pogo stick. It will literaly jump off the ground when you compress it and let it go (not installed on the bike yet). Something tells me the manual must be wrong. Any suggestions?

(I have some KX125 forks that I am going to put on the bike at some stage, but they need rebuilding so untill then I am running the standard forks)

 

[Dirtdame]

If your forks have no dampening after a mod to the shim stack, you better check your work. I installed the Racetech Gold Valve kit on my 2003 KDX220 and it turned out very nice and I used Hondaline 5 wt. fork oil in those forks.

 

[sr5bidder]

when you added the fork oil did you do so with the springs out and in the collapsed position?

check your work too you only take 3 shims off the compression side of the stack

 

[dirt bike dave]

IMO, it's pretty hard to judge the fork when it is not on the bike.

If you think your oil level is in the ball park, I'd put it the forks on the bike and take it for a test ride.

Oil weight is mainly going to effect rebound damping, but I'd want a test ride before replacing the oil.

 

[Joburble]

Thanks for your input guys. I took 2 shims out, added oil with springs out and fork compressed. 580ml of oil came out, 580ml of oil went back in, measured height from top of tube as a double check. In regard to the work, I did it at a friends house with his help, he did his shim stack last week and his works fine, he used 10wt oil. The oil that came out of my forks looks a lot thicker than 5wt more like 15 and slightly tacky (weird). I am confident the work carried out was done properly but hey if I can't figure it out I will pull it apart and check it. Is everyone running 5wt oil?

@ dirt bike dave, the fork seems so far wrong that I don't think testing it in the bike is going to be worth it, if it was even slightly close to any fork i've ever felf before i'd give it a try but it really is just a pogo stick.

@ sr5bidder, compression side of the stack? Ummm... isn't there only one stack in that assembly that comes out of the bottom of the fork leg or are you trying to confuse me :think:

 

[Matt90GT]

this pic is of a TC fork, but should help you:

 

[Dirtdame]

compression side of the stack? Ummm... isn't there only one stack in that assembly that comes out of the bottom of the fork leg :think:

That's correct, you have what is known as an inverted shim stack if it is the stock valving. It is enclosed in a little frame (and all the little shims that are stock all seem to be the exact same size). I didn't even know that this type of setup was worth trying to revalve. When I asked about it from several different sources, they told me to just go with the Gold Valve kit.

Stock should look very much like this unit here.

 

[sr5bidder]

you both seem to be right the last stack i did was the rear and I was remebering wrong sorry


Jo did you get all the air out?

 

[Joburble]

Stock should look very much like this unit here.

Yup, that's the one.

Fork oil weight? The owners manual says 5w-20, the service manual says 5wt. It's all so confusing, isn't 5W-20 a multigrade oil?

I'd love to know what weight, grade, type/make of oil you guys out there are using in your H model KDX's (standard fork). Cheers.

 

[glad2ride]

5 weight is correct.

Did you bleed the cartridge??

 

[Joburble]

I turned the fork upside down and pumped the damping rod untill all the oil was out, is that what you mean?

 

[sr5bidder]

running the fork through its stroke with the spring out to clear all the air in the fork oil

you really should have used the compressed fork oil hiehgt measurement method discribed in the manual

 

[sr5bidder]

well I went to searching on my shim stack mod thread and couldn't find it but then I recall the mention of a tool use to hold something ..maybe the 44023 CYLINDER-COMP-FORK if you did not have access to a impact gun,,,..

is it possible that the base valve did not screw back into part # 44023

jeez its been so long, please forgive me if I am thinking wrong, just trying to help

 

[Joburble]

Yeah, I had wondered if the shimstack assembly had screwed back into # 44023 properly and on inspection I believe it did.

I have a tool for undoing the shimstack assembly while holding part # 44023.

Last night I had rebuilt both forks with 10wt oil. I pulled out shim stack assemblies and shims from both forks and checked them, oil level measured 87mm down from the top of the fork tube with spring out and fork compressed as per manual. Pumped damping rod many times to make sure all air was out of the fork. Assembled both forks. They seemed damped very slightly different. (Not on the bike)

 

[glad2ride]

Did you take the damper rods out? Did you lose the "top out" spring? It is about 40mm or so long and about 15mm in outer diameter.

Your old oil was in need of replacement. The thick gunk called old oil may have hidden the problem.

Also, your damper rod bushings may be worn out. These are 10mm inner diameter and go inside the seal head. I almost NEVER see anyone even mention them in ANY KDX fork thread, but they need to be checked. And you may want to get with Terry Hay to secure the parts in AUS. Race Tech sells them.

 

[Joburble]

Yes I took the damper rods out and the "top out" spring is intact and in its proper place.
I hope my damper rod bushings aren't worn out, the bikes only done 31 hours from new.

Damper rod bushings? Not quite sure which bit you mean.


EDITED: - Okay, I know what you mean now.

 

[glad2ride]

Well, if it is just 31 hours, then nevermind.

Good to know on the springs.

 

[Joburble]

Quality control?

I have found the problem.

Conclusion: The ID of the two damper tubes is very slightly different, hence very slightly different rebound damping. Must have made those forks on a Monday eh! If the bike was old and had done a lot of work I'd expect that, but this thing has done 31hrs from new. All that said and done I'd still rather ride it than a new KLX450. On a side note, Kawasaki really should bring out a nice new KDX300 to compete with the other 300's :nod:

 

[Joburble]

In my spare time I'll recon the KX125 forks I bought for it and put them on as soon as I can.

 

[glad2ride]

Are you talking about the inner or outer bushing of roughly 43mm diameter or the 10mm ID bushing inside the seal head??

No need to just ride it, as something is wrong.

 

[sr5bidder]

I'm glad your not banging your head and found the issue

 

[Joburble]

Fork internals

 

[dirt bike dave]

Personally, I'd put it back together and ride it.

The rebound forces on the fork leg with the bike attached and going down the trail are going to cause the fork to behave much differently than it does when you compress the leg on your garage floor.

Seems like it worked well enough the first 31 hours that you never noticed a problem.

My guess is it will work fine and no one would ever be able to tell from riding the bike that it had a problem.

 

[Joburble]

Yeah, that's kind of how I feel about it too.