Vortip Insert for WR250F

[alfadave]

I've read the posts about the noise levels of the WR/YZs, but I've only seen a little discussion on the inserts available for the stock pipes. These things seem too good to be true. Before I buy one, I'd love to hear details from someone who has personal experience with one.

I have a WR250F and I've discovered that it just won't make any midrange power with the stock baffle installed. I've tried rejetting and removing the airbox lid but it makes no difference. When I remove the cork the midrange comes alive. The difference is amazing. However, I'd like to have it quieter too. Can I have my cake and eat it too? The sellers of the inserts claim that they keep noise within a few dbs of the stock baffle but completely unrestrict the pipe like it is just open (no baffle at all). If that's true, I think it's well worth the money to annoy a few less people and maybe even keep my head from shaking and reduce headaches.

This seems too good to be true. Does anyone have experience with these inserts? I'd really be interested in hearing about experience with the WR250F or another bike that simply won't run worth a crap with the stock baffle. I'm a lot more concerened with a smooth power curve (no dead spots) than overall power. Thanks.

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[TexKDX]

I ran the Vortip in my 400. It is rated as ISDE legal, 93 db. Not sure how it would work in the 250, other than a HECK of alot better than the stock restrictor. You are right, unless you let it breathe then the mods won't matter.

I applaud you for not just chucking the stock baffle and running it wide open. The bikes are just too darned loud and not buying us any ground that way.

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TexKDX

 

[ButtonFly]

I run one in my 400 also. It is noticably different from the open pipe, but also MUCH better than the stock insert. My Vortip takes a little bit out of the punch (YZ timed) and a little top end, but for putting around the woods and such, it isn't terribly noticable. THe Vortip is well made, fits, and functions as advertised. I am very happy with mine, and like the fact that I can run very quiet, which I choose to do most of the time. About the only place the Vortip really affects my riding noticably is at the dunes, and I take it out about a quarter of the time just for a little more punch.

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[LawManNv]

Hi,
I just installed the Vortip in my WR250F yesterday. At first I ran the bike with the plug in to keep it quiet but it performs so much better without it. Out in the desert the uncorked exhaust is ok but everywhere else it is loud. With the Vortip it is louder than with the plug but it is still much quieter than aftermarket exhausts. The bike felt like it ran as well as it did without the stock plug. And , you can't beat the price $54. In my opinion it is well worth every cent. I ordered it from Fineline Suspension, they are great people to deal with. Thanks for the link ButtonFly. The web site is www.finelinesuspension.com or call them at (714) 84-CYCLE. Good luck.

LawManNv

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'01 WR250F
'00 KDX200 (For Sale)

 

[BCooper]

I too may order the Vortip for my WR250. I have the complete Big Gun Race series head pipe and silencer w/quiet core insert, but don't like it. It has allowed me to pass sound tests, but at the cost of my midrange. I have tried jetting up and down until I'm totally worn out, but with no improvements to be found. The bike does pull hard on the bottom and absolutely screams on top, but the midrange is just lazy. My stock pipe with the baffle removed pulled harder over a wider range than the Big Gun, but was louder and didn't have the potency on top. I'll try the Vortip for sure if it will help.

Coop, who is sick of playing with the jetting on this bike.

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2001 WR250F

 

[LawManNv]

BCooper,
I am also sick of trying to jet this thing. My bike still runs like you described. It has awesome low end and screams on top but the mid range is ok. I keep going richer on the jets and it is getting better but it is a pain to change them. Currently I am running a 180 main, needle in the 4th positon, 45 pilot, and the air screw two turns out. I think I might still need to go richer. If you wide wide open it is fast but I wish I could find more mid power.

LawManNv

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'01 WR250F
'00 KDX200 (For Sale)

 

[alfadave]

Thanks a bunch everyone. I just ordered one from Fineline. They really do seem great to deal with. I'm having it overnighted. I'll test it Thursday and give you my report. Watch this spot.

p.s Isn't it interesting that the 6 reviews I read of this bike all fail to mention the flat spot in midrange? Does anyone know of a dyno chart of the WR250F? I found two for the YZ (and they do show a flat spot), but I'd like to see one for the WR.

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[BCooper]

Alfadave, If you run it uncorked there is no flat spot in the middle, but man is it loud. Try to quieten it down though and the middle goes.

LawManNV, I was given jetting specs from Big Gun which were for the YZ. They didn't even know what came stock in the bike until I told them. They first told me to go to a 180 main until I told them that 170 was stock (they thought 175 was stock) then it was, "well, uhh, try a 175 main." With a 175 main the bike wouldn't get over 45 mph, so I dropped it to a 172main, better but still not good. Went back to stock 170 and the top came back but the midrange was still absent. Then I began the needle adjust boogie.(Spent about three hours this past Sunday) Adjust, go ride, adjust, go ride, etc. The midrange is still not with me, but its rideable. Oh, let's not forget that pilot jet! BG said to go to a 45 pilot. Tried it and the thing kept stalling very easily in first. I finally went back to the stock 42 pilot and my bottom was normal again. I haven't touched the fuel screw because the thing ran so great with the stock pipe and always started easy.
I am at a loss here. Don't know what to do!
Any help from you four stroke gurus would be appreciated.
Coop

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2001 WR250F

 

[theMotoMan]

There has been discussion on ThumperTalk about WR mods for more performance and many of them are running different pipes. There is a special forum for the WR/YZ250F and lots of good discussion. I know there is a guy there with the handle Lawman and he is running the BigGun with good results.
http://www.thumpertalk.com

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01 YZ250F
00 TTR-125L
00 TTR-90
00 PW-50

 

[LawManNv]

I have been having good luck going richer. Another WR owner has been doing the same thing and is up to a 188 main with the needle in the 5th position and is considering going bigger. He said the power keeps getting better. Of course he is at a lot less elevation than me but I am going to try the 5th needle position and a bigger main jet. With the stock jetting my plug was white and as I am going richer the power keeps getting better.

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'01 WR250F
'00 KDX200 (For Sale)

 

[BCooper]

theMotoMan,
Hmmm, :confused: It just so happens that I HAVE Lawman's Big Gun pipe. Thankfully, he was there to help me jet this thing before the Great Piney Woods Enduro. Lawman is also on this board and has recently shed his YZ for a KTM 400RFS. Something about old age and tired of kicking. hehehe :p He did have good luck with it on his YZ, but once again it was a YZ and not a WR. The power delivery is different between the two because of numerous things, which may include cam timing, carb settings(jetting), as well as some little diaphram doodad that the YZ's carb doesn't have. Lawman experienced much improved bottom end as well as better top end when he had it on his YZ. I'm looking to sell this pipe to a YZ owner and find something that will work with my WR and that will be quiet.

LawManNV, Did I understand you to say that you lost midrange with your Vortip?

Coop

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2001 WR250F

[This message has been edited by BCooper (edited 04-18-2001).]

[This message has been edited by BCooper (edited 04-18-2001).]

[This message has been edited by BCooper (edited 04-18-2001).]

 

[joeblack]

Anyone have pictures of the Vortip or something similar? All I need is a spark arrestor and I'm thinking of going the BMP route, but don't like the look. Does the vortip come with spark arresting abilites?
BTW, I was going to get an aftermarket slip on, but all the reports on it say their all loud! I was going to go Big Gun Quiet, but they don't sell a pipe that will fit the stock header on my yz250f.


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[ButtonFly]

www.finelinesuspension.com should have a pic.

Bcooper, you could consider YZ timing for your WR. It is a roundabout means of solving your problem, but lots of people have tuning experience with YZ/WRs on thumpertalk. That is how I have mine setup. VERY nice. Easier to jump in the sand with for me.

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[BCooper]

ButtonFly,
I may give that a try. When you changed yours what differences did you see from stock?

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2001 WR250F

 

[LawManNv]

joeblack,
The Vortip fits the stock WR's exhaust. I don't think I lost any midrange with the Vortip. I am going for a longer ride today and will post my findings. From the first short ride I took it felt just like it did with the stock pipe uncorked but not nearly as loud.

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'01 WR250F
'00 KDX200 (For Sale)

 

[ButtonFly]

The engine seemed to vibrate just a little more, there is a noticable top end "hit" that wasn't there before. There seems to be less compression braking (noticable, but not two stroke land). It wants to be ridden a bit harder with YZ timing (at least I think so) and steered around with the rear in a lot of cases, and doesn't lug quite as much. I personnally like the changes YZ timing has made, as it makes it easier and more fun to ride open areas, MX tracks, and dunes. It does take some jetting to get it right.

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[lawman]

hey! i resemble that remark!

it's interesting reading everyone's comments about sorting out the new bikes. the yz seemed to me to flatten out pretty early; sure, it'll keep revving just like the mags say, but it isn't making much new power way up on top , at least with the stock pipe. the big gun quiet pipe really is as quiet as they say, & on the yz at least, made big gains on the bottom & a little on top, w/no detriment in the middle. sorry to hear of so much trouble tuning with it on the wr.

i need to sell my yz b/c my intended use for it changed, & i was spending big $ converting my yz into a wr. then i found a barely-used ktm 400 (with the old-guy button & old-guy torque & interchangeable parts w/my other bike) & couldn't pass it up. so my yz is officially for sale.

 

[WIthumper]

I checked with a local shop to find out if they had a Vortip in stock. They did not, but they ended up calling White Brothers to see if they actually made one for the WR250F. The local shop later called me back and mentioned WB's does not make one for the WR250F.

I'm confused.

LawManNv, did it just bolt on, or did you have to do some constructive surgery?

Thanks,
WIthumper

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[BUCKWHEAT]

Stroker offers an insert for the WR250F muffler called the "dual sport quiet insert". I ordered one yesterday and will post the results soon. It was 50 bucks and will fit the Stroker muffler also should I choose to buy one of those later on.

They have a pic of it at strokerspeed.com in the exhaust section. It's listed as being for a stock WR400 or TTR250 muffler but will fit the 250F also.

Thump on!

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[LawManNv]

WIthumper,
Installation was as easy as removing one bolt, inserting the Vortip, and putting the supplied bolt back in. Two minutes at the most. If you are interested call Fineline Suspension, the number and web site are listed above. I think they have the cheapest price and are very nice people. Good luck.

LawManNv

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'01 WR250F
'00 KDX200 (For Sale)

 

[alfadave]

I rode yesterday with the new Vortip insert and I am VERY impressed. The bike is quiet and runs great. It really seams a quiet as with the stock insert. The midrange flat spot is gone. Why Yamaha doesn't sell the bike with a similar insert eludes me. They really deserve a dope slap for the stock baffle. The only use for it is as a paperweight. The Vortip is definitely the way to go with the WR250F. With the stock insert I stalled the bike a lot; with the Vortip I didn't stall once. And I crashed more when I used the stock baffle. Ok, Ok, I'm sure that isn't related. :-)

Any by the way, my previous bike was a '98 XR400. My WR250F is better in EVERY way. More low end grunt (that amazes me); it's better through the really nasty rocks; it seems faster, more responsive, and more powerful; it's noticeably lighter; it handles better; the seat is more comfortable (57% less monkey butt); and it starts easier. I think I'm in love.

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It's never too late to have a happy childhood.

 

[BCooper]

I ordered a Vortip this morning. I just hope it solves my problem. :) At least it is cheap, unlike a complete exhaust system. From what you describe, Alfadave, it is just what I need. I'll post my results as soon as it gets here.
Coop

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2001 WR250F

 

[WIthumper]

Based on what I read here, I just ordered one as well earlier today. When I called fineline suspension, they were wondering why they were getting a big influx of orders all of a sudden, so I mentioned DirtRider.net and gave us a good plug. As you BCooper, alfadave, etc... I am also looking to help keep the noise factor down without impacting the fun factor. I am picking up my WR250 tomorrow, and after going through the newbee maintenance requirements, I can't wait to hit the trails!

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[RakO]

This the way European WRs are delivered.....how to take out the insert ...any ideas http://mcnews.com.au/Testing/Yamaha/WR250F/b_400p.jpg

RakO

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