Completely Off Topic - DIVORCE
- Thread starter CR_Dave
- Start date
cr dave great reply, Not being around, even including my very close friends, divorce, it somthing i can't understand, I realize now your situation is a little different with her affair, somtimes you can't control what others do or feel.
I hate to bring religion into this but, it seems like going into a church and getting mairred sould accually mean somthing, I'm no expert but marriage is so two become one, FOREVER, in Gods eyes. I thinkit alway seems like, in my biased opion, that woman are the ones who give up.
I applaude you cr dave for staying faithfull. All I have to say is stay mature about everything, it will set a good example for the kids. Hang in there.
I hate to bring religion into this but, it seems like going into a church and getting mairred sould accually mean somthing, I'm no expert but marriage is so two become one, FOREVER, in Gods eyes. I thinkit alway seems like, in my biased opion, that woman are the ones who give up.
I applaude you cr dave for staying faithfull. All I have to say is stay mature about everything, it will set a good example for the kids. Hang in there.
IRISHCOFFEE
Member
- Aug 3, 2002
- 194
- 0
lot of good people on this site! the advice on QUALITY lawyers is spot on. a quality female lawyer is even better in many cases like this. ochsterseems to know. also, Casa is a great suggestion.
Dave,
I just saw this string. I am in the same situation. I was divorced over 7 years ago. My ex is still drunk with anger. Right now, I am on the tail end of a contempt charge that she started against me. She said I owed her $175. This action has been going on for about a year and a half. So far I have about $5500 tied up in this action... I can only assume she has at least as much (probably more). Obviously, her goal is not to recover $175. Her goal is to do anything she can do to hurt me, even if that means she gets hurt herself.
What you need, Dave, is a good dose of the truth. I am sure that all of these guys on here that tell you that things will get better are well meaning, but they are wrong. At least, you need to assume they are wrong. You need to protect yourself. I can tell by the tone of your posts that you fall in the same trap so many other men do. You want to be amicable. You want to be nice. You want to be quiet and just make everything go away. With that attitude, you are only making things worse... trust me, I know.
If your lawyer is not a bulldog-- fire him. You need to accept the fact that things are not going to be quiet. You are in a war. Act like it! But be smart. Here's how I did it:
1)Stay focused. Your entire life is centered around custody of your kids. Everything you do is for that purpose. She will try to drag you into a fight. Don't fight back. When two people are fighting, an outsider (i.e. judge) will only see two bitter, childish people. If you are both rotten parents, either your kids go to foster care or she gets them. You have to show that she is bitter and vindictive, but you are stable and even tempered.
2)Every encounter with her is an opportunity to gather evidence. USE IT! Every phone call is recorded (most states allow you to record a call that you are a party to without informing the other party). Save all of her phone messages. Every time you meet her, you should have a tape recorder in your pocket on record. Every note or letter she writes is kept. Maintain a diary that memorializes every event that is pertinent... both the bad ones involving her and the good ones involving you. If applicable, hire a private investigator. Don't be cheap. Your kids are worth it. Your case has to be overwhelming.
3)Don't EVER speak ill of her in front of your kids, or where your kids could possibly overhear. You must insist that your kids be respectful and mindful of her (even if she doesn't deserve it). Tell them that their mom loves them and they should love her as well. Tell them that you won't tolerate them being disrespectful to her. You can explain disagreements between you and her, but never do it in the tone of "your mom is wrong".
4)Interact with her as little as possible. Remember, every time you open your mouth, you give her an opportunity to gather evidence. Don't EVER do anything wrong. Before you act, think of what the judge would say if he were there to witness. Always take the high road. Continue to turn the other cheek.
5)Remember, she is drunk with anger. One thing that is common about drunk and angry people is that they use very poor judgement. Just be patient, she will feed you all the ammunition you need. Basically, just let her rant and rave. Let her spill her evidence all over the floor... just make sure you are there to sweep it up and keep it for your later use. Give her all the rope she wants. She will make a noose intended for you, but I promise you, she will stick her own head in it.
6)Very important-- don't ever expect her to do anything rational. Like I said, she is drunk. She will not be rational. She will not make reasonable decisions. Hence, my ex spending over $5500 to try to recover $175. People who are this angry do not care if they are hurt by their actions (or if their kids are hurt) as long as they cause injury to the person they are angry at. Your kids are targets. Be aware of that. Once she realizes (I think she already has) that the one sure way she can hurt you is to hurt your kids, she will take advantage of that. I know it sounds sick, but she is not rational. Don't expect her to be.
Once you are divorced, don't plan on it getting better. If she is truly angry and bitter like you say, she won't calm down after the divorce. These rules will apply until your kids are 18. You ALWAYS must take the high road and you ALWAYS must take advantage of any opportunity to gather evidence you can. DO NOT GET SOFT! Once you have a court order in place that favors you and the court recognizes that you are the stable one, then you can be generous. Until then, you are at war.
I won custody of my son when he was 4. I was on active duty in the Navy. She wasn't an alcoholic. She was not abusive to my son. And, our divorce was in South Carolina. There is no way in hell I should have won custody. But I did. And it was all because I was focused and she was angry.
If you want to discuss anything further, email me at [email protected]. I have my fingers crossed for you. Just don't believe that things will get better on their own. They will only get better if you take the actions necessary so that you can dictate the outcome. Good luck.
Jimbo
I just saw this string. I am in the same situation. I was divorced over 7 years ago. My ex is still drunk with anger. Right now, I am on the tail end of a contempt charge that she started against me. She said I owed her $175. This action has been going on for about a year and a half. So far I have about $5500 tied up in this action... I can only assume she has at least as much (probably more). Obviously, her goal is not to recover $175. Her goal is to do anything she can do to hurt me, even if that means she gets hurt herself.
What you need, Dave, is a good dose of the truth. I am sure that all of these guys on here that tell you that things will get better are well meaning, but they are wrong. At least, you need to assume they are wrong. You need to protect yourself. I can tell by the tone of your posts that you fall in the same trap so many other men do. You want to be amicable. You want to be nice. You want to be quiet and just make everything go away. With that attitude, you are only making things worse... trust me, I know.
If your lawyer is not a bulldog-- fire him. You need to accept the fact that things are not going to be quiet. You are in a war. Act like it! But be smart. Here's how I did it:
1)Stay focused. Your entire life is centered around custody of your kids. Everything you do is for that purpose. She will try to drag you into a fight. Don't fight back. When two people are fighting, an outsider (i.e. judge) will only see two bitter, childish people. If you are both rotten parents, either your kids go to foster care or she gets them. You have to show that she is bitter and vindictive, but you are stable and even tempered.
2)Every encounter with her is an opportunity to gather evidence. USE IT! Every phone call is recorded (most states allow you to record a call that you are a party to without informing the other party). Save all of her phone messages. Every time you meet her, you should have a tape recorder in your pocket on record. Every note or letter she writes is kept. Maintain a diary that memorializes every event that is pertinent... both the bad ones involving her and the good ones involving you. If applicable, hire a private investigator. Don't be cheap. Your kids are worth it. Your case has to be overwhelming.
3)Don't EVER speak ill of her in front of your kids, or where your kids could possibly overhear. You must insist that your kids be respectful and mindful of her (even if she doesn't deserve it). Tell them that their mom loves them and they should love her as well. Tell them that you won't tolerate them being disrespectful to her. You can explain disagreements between you and her, but never do it in the tone of "your mom is wrong".
4)Interact with her as little as possible. Remember, every time you open your mouth, you give her an opportunity to gather evidence. Don't EVER do anything wrong. Before you act, think of what the judge would say if he were there to witness. Always take the high road. Continue to turn the other cheek.
5)Remember, she is drunk with anger. One thing that is common about drunk and angry people is that they use very poor judgement. Just be patient, she will feed you all the ammunition you need. Basically, just let her rant and rave. Let her spill her evidence all over the floor... just make sure you are there to sweep it up and keep it for your later use. Give her all the rope she wants. She will make a noose intended for you, but I promise you, she will stick her own head in it.
6)Very important-- don't ever expect her to do anything rational. Like I said, she is drunk. She will not be rational. She will not make reasonable decisions. Hence, my ex spending over $5500 to try to recover $175. People who are this angry do not care if they are hurt by their actions (or if their kids are hurt) as long as they cause injury to the person they are angry at. Your kids are targets. Be aware of that. Once she realizes (I think she already has) that the one sure way she can hurt you is to hurt your kids, she will take advantage of that. I know it sounds sick, but she is not rational. Don't expect her to be.
Once you are divorced, don't plan on it getting better. If she is truly angry and bitter like you say, she won't calm down after the divorce. These rules will apply until your kids are 18. You ALWAYS must take the high road and you ALWAYS must take advantage of any opportunity to gather evidence you can. DO NOT GET SOFT! Once you have a court order in place that favors you and the court recognizes that you are the stable one, then you can be generous. Until then, you are at war.
I won custody of my son when he was 4. I was on active duty in the Navy. She wasn't an alcoholic. She was not abusive to my son. And, our divorce was in South Carolina. There is no way in hell I should have won custody. But I did. And it was all because I was focused and she was angry.
If you want to discuss anything further, email me at [email protected]. I have my fingers crossed for you. Just don't believe that things will get better on their own. They will only get better if you take the actions necessary so that you can dictate the outcome. Good luck.
Jimbo
Last edited:
- Thread starter
- #33
She assaulted me in the summer with a cell phone. I got a pretty bad concussion. I got a protection from abuse against her and then she filed one as well. typical legal strategy on her part. basically it says no contac t between she and i. i dropped mine against her about 2 months later because she was keeping the kids from my family because of the order (she says). i decided to get rid of it for my kids. she did not drop hers. the flawed process is this:
1. she gets a bug up her a** and files a frivolous complaint to the police
2. a warrant is issues for my arrest
3. they take you to jail and slowly process you for arraignment. typically the same day 5-10 hours later. you butt is still in jail.
4. get arraigned, pay bail, court date set for judge within 10 days.
5. penality if found guilty is up to 6 months in jail
6. i spend big bucks fighting the frivolous complaints. the judge is getting tired and hopefully at the verge of taking away her order.
PS - things went well last week. no decision form judge until the 12th though.
- Thread starter
- #34
my lawyer is a female and a pitbull when needed. i push her buttons at times saying the other lawyer is pushing her around. she gets mad and it lights a fire under her. we have a great relationship. she is ready to turn the tables once i get through this frivolous complaints. i feel confident about custody.
i also have in my pocket civil suits against her for assault and battery and the damager it caused to my brain, job, etc. that is not my focus now until I get things consistent for the kids through custody. but it is coming.
i also have in my pocket civil suits against her for assault and battery and the damager it caused to my brain, job, etc. that is not my focus now until I get things consistent for the kids through custody. but it is coming.
Dave,
Man, you are standing on a slippery slope. Even though you certainly have the right to file civil suits, I wouldn't do it. You are just perpetuating the fight. Remember, if you fight with a pig, you get dirty and the pig loves it. Anyway, what could you possibly get from her that is of any value (i.e. is she rich??).
My ex knocked out a bridge in my mouth, vandalized my cars, had me arrested twice, and tried to burn down the apartment building where I was at. This just scratches the surface.
You are never going to get even. Don't try. I promise, for every legitimate action you take, she will take three frivolous actions. You and I both know who will really come out on the short end of that situation. The most valuable lesson you can learn is that the opposite of love is not hate... it is apathy. You are successful when you get to the point that you honestly do not care about her at all. That should be your goal.
Jimbo
Man, you are standing on a slippery slope. Even though you certainly have the right to file civil suits, I wouldn't do it. You are just perpetuating the fight. Remember, if you fight with a pig, you get dirty and the pig loves it. Anyway, what could you possibly get from her that is of any value (i.e. is she rich??).
My ex knocked out a bridge in my mouth, vandalized my cars, had me arrested twice, and tried to burn down the apartment building where I was at. This just scratches the surface.
You are never going to get even. Don't try. I promise, for every legitimate action you take, she will take three frivolous actions. You and I both know who will really come out on the short end of that situation. The most valuable lesson you can learn is that the opposite of love is not hate... it is apathy. You are successful when you get to the point that you honestly do not care about her at all. That should be your goal.
Jimbo
- Thread starter
- #36
i kno w, that is why iam not doing anything with it. i am just leveraging it to get out of this other bs. i do not want it to perpetuate. persuing it would mean i would not be focusing on the kids if i did it.
thaks for the advice. t wo wrongs don;t make a right
thaks for the advice. t wo wrongs don;t make a right
IRISHCOFFEE
Member
- Aug 3, 2002
- 194
- 0
Jimbokdx nailed it. words of wisdom many should read!
Tony Williams
LIFETIME SPONSOR
- Mar 23, 2000
- 592
- 0
My divorce almost 10 years ago was with one attorney drawing up an agreement for both of us, and me basically handing over everthing (house, child custody). I thought that would make things easy.
No way.
We're still at war. We've been back to court several times over the years. And, now I have a very expensive, female attorney. Only 3 1/2 years of child support payments to go. :worship:
Tony,
Ya know... you are very typical of what I have observed. You want to just admit that things are over, give her such an unbalanced (in her favor) settlement that she could not argue with it, and then she just ends up screwing you even further. I'm sure that if you would would have had your own lawyer in the beginning, you would not have had nearly the problems you have had over the last ten years.
Lesson is... there is no such thing as an easy divorce. Once divorce is decided, you are officially at war until the divorce is over. Any man that does not accept this declaration of war will quickly become a victim.
Jimbo
Ya know... you are very typical of what I have observed. You want to just admit that things are over, give her such an unbalanced (in her favor) settlement that she could not argue with it, and then she just ends up screwing you even further. I'm sure that if you would would have had your own lawyer in the beginning, you would not have had nearly the problems you have had over the last ten years.
Lesson is... there is no such thing as an easy divorce. Once divorce is decided, you are officially at war until the divorce is over. Any man that does not accept this declaration of war will quickly become a victim.
Jimbo
Amen to that!!!! It's hard enough when you get a lawyer and properly prepare, but without one your in for it.
I have been separated / divorced for going on five years now and have been through alot things similar to the points in this thread (the irrational ex that just wants to hurt you at all cost, false protective orders to try to get custody etc). We signed a legal separation that laid out the property settlement (in which I purchased the house) and the visitation of our two children, 2 and 6 at the time. Some 18 months later, and several trips to court, we were divorced. Things are no better now than they were from day one. From one agreed order to the next, three in all, she still threatens to and actually files court motions against me constantly. I do not think this will ever end!!! What is fustrating is she is th one that wanted out!!
I have cared for these kids and done as much for them as I can through this process, but I get zero help or cooperation. She gets the kids every other weekend and on Tuesday nights. I keep them the rest of the time and pay 100% of all their expenses, then my mother tells me she hears through the grapevine that my ex is telling everyone what a rotten parent I am and that I won't even pay her child support, S%$# she should be paying me!!! That's bad, but nothing I can do about it. The important thing is that the kids are in their home in a stable environment the majority of the time.
Well I got rambling there and about forgot my point, which is, even after the court hearings, whether she gets her way or not, do not expect things to go smoothly for some time. Irrational people can be very frustrating, just try to keep your head and focus on what's best.
Good luck and I'll keep my fingers crossed for you. It would also help you to follw Jimbo's advise. I also document everyday what happens in our lives.
Boots
I have been separated / divorced for going on five years now and have been through alot things similar to the points in this thread (the irrational ex that just wants to hurt you at all cost, false protective orders to try to get custody etc). We signed a legal separation that laid out the property settlement (in which I purchased the house) and the visitation of our two children, 2 and 6 at the time. Some 18 months later, and several trips to court, we were divorced. Things are no better now than they were from day one. From one agreed order to the next, three in all, she still threatens to and actually files court motions against me constantly. I do not think this will ever end!!! What is fustrating is she is th one that wanted out!!
I have cared for these kids and done as much for them as I can through this process, but I get zero help or cooperation. She gets the kids every other weekend and on Tuesday nights. I keep them the rest of the time and pay 100% of all their expenses, then my mother tells me she hears through the grapevine that my ex is telling everyone what a rotten parent I am and that I won't even pay her child support, S%$# she should be paying me!!! That's bad, but nothing I can do about it. The important thing is that the kids are in their home in a stable environment the majority of the time.
Well I got rambling there and about forgot my point, which is, even after the court hearings, whether she gets her way or not, do not expect things to go smoothly for some time. Irrational people can be very frustrating, just try to keep your head and focus on what's best.
Good luck and I'll keep my fingers crossed for you. It would also help you to follw Jimbo's advise. I also document everyday what happens in our lives.
Boots
- Oct 20, 2000
- 2,963
- 2
It's too bad you can't get the ex's to understand that the kids are the one's losing out. They will take in everything they see and hear and interpret it in a way only kids can. I was fortunant for the most part, my ex does understand that point. Mine, as all are was a bitter divorce. Really out of charecter as we never fought when we were married but you couldn't tell it during the divorce. I told her that the two of us had a choice, we could either choose to get along or not get along, only one that would loose is our child. We will deal with each other until one of us is dead and that's the plain & simple. She agreed and the problems have been minimul. That's not to say anyone was right or wrong, just that we forget to think about the consequences sometimes and the kid is the first to notice.
btw, I get no child support.
btw, I get no child support.
It's amazing, when a woman begins to feed on the rotting carcass of her own marriage (that's a colorful metaphor for divorce), she looses all of her mothering instinct. The kid comes last, first is the voracious appetite for blood. It's a sickness.
My opinion is that when we get married, it is a contract. Remember when you said "'till death do you part"? Well, I believe that when a couple is getting divorced, the judge shouldn't be deciding on who gets the kids and who gets the house.... he should be deciding on who has to die! That would probably trim down the divorce rate (that is running about 50% - 60%).
Jimbo
My opinion is that when we get married, it is a contract. Remember when you said "'till death do you part"? Well, I believe that when a couple is getting divorced, the judge shouldn't be deciding on who gets the kids and who gets the house.... he should be deciding on who has to die! That would probably trim down the divorce rate (that is running about 50% - 60%).
Jimbo
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