Time for a name change?

[Okiewan]

It won't start? Humm... I don't seem to have that problem with either the CRF or YZF. Drop it, turn it over, whatever.

Face it my brothers, 2-strokes are going away. You can call the whammmmbulance if you like, but the writing is obviously on the wall. You can talk about the efficiency of the 2-stroke til you turn green (pun intended)... enjoy it in your weed whacker while you can, it's not going to be in MX bikes or your yard tools much longer.

Doesn't your Euro MX world revolve around Everts? Pichon? Smets? What do they ride? Why do they ride it? The undisputed fastest MX'er on the planet will ride the 450 this year. Why? HRC conspiracy?

It takes more cc's... what exactly are the weight to hp ratios? Are they that far off? How long do you think it will be before the 4-stroke has a better ratio? 2 years? 1? For some (apparent silly) reason, the fastest riders on the planet are going 4-stroke. How can that be? How can they make such uninformed decisions? Did they not consult Bruce first? :laugh: Everyone knows that only slow fat guys and woods riders like thumpers. It seems they aren't bothered by your cc : hp math.. they want the bike that will get them around the track the fastest. Infidels!

I'm not sure what this love affair with "X"-Stroke is all about. I was around MX when the 2-Stroke was the newbie, I'm around for the 4-stroke coming back. I couldn't care less. Whatever bike I feel more comfortable on, I'll ride.

< begin Saturday Night live/ Dana Carvey "old guy on a park bench" Skit >
Back in the day, the dentist just ripped that tooth-out... no fancy high tech pain killers, no nuttin! An WE LIKED IT.
< end skit >

 

[bclapham]

Actually, Marcus does bring up some good points- wether you like it or not, the 4-strokes are costing more to buy in the first place, and i am sorry if this upsets anyone, but they are no cheaper to run and need no less maintainance.

ive been looking recently and a new 450 is at least always $1000 more expensive than a 250

its a shame since racing/riding costs are spiraling- how the hell can these companies justifiy $600+ on a pipe?

as for starting, its when they get hot- now i am sure this might cause a stir since i understand some of you guys dont race, but some of these thumpers arent good starters-a friend of mine raced a brand new CRF250 last week- after a 20 min pro moto, he brought it into the pits- i wanted to take it for a spin, but it just wouldnt restart untill it had cooled. one thing i like about thumpers is the starting, i dont know how many places i have made up going past a much better rider mercilessly trying to kick their bike back to life.

but alas, i do think a lot about what my next bike will be- either an rm250 or a crf450

 

[bclapham]

For some (apparent silly) reason, the fastest riders on the planet are going 4-stroke.

only because they have a HP advantage because they are allowed more CCs, otherwise why didnt they run the 250F in the 250 class?

 

[HiG4s]

I'm not sure what this love affair with "X"-Stroke is all about. I was around MX when the 2-Stroke was the newbie, I'm around for the 4-stroke coming back. I couldn't care less. Whatever bike I feel more comfortable on, I'll ride.
QUOTE]

When the 2-stroke was the newbie what size engines did the rules allow them in the open class compared to the 4-strokes?

Maybe the AMA should just limit the horsepower and weight for each class and allow any engine type? Now wouldn't that be a can of worms?

 

[truespode]

ive been looking recently and a new 450 is at least always $1000 more expensive than a 250

That is more a factor of supply and demand. Right now 4-strokes are in high demand so the price is higher.

When it comes to the rebuilds... there are more parts so yes that is going to be more expensive.

Ivan

 

[mx547]

i went to round five of the okla. state championships last weekend. in the 250 pro class, there were only two four-strokes, first place and last place. the rest were on two-strokes. in the 125 pro class, nearly all were four-strokes. continue with discussion...

 

[Okiewan]

For sure, there are still a lot of 2-strokes in the "big" Pro class, I'm wondering what the Nationals will look like though?

The Kawasuki hasn't released (450) yet, I suspect when that happens, there will be fewer 2-strokes even at the local level, in the big class.

Besides Jay, those are OK races. We are behind the rest of the planet by at least a year :laugh:

 

[Okiewan]

only because they have a HP advantage because they are allowed more CCs, otherwise why didnt they run the 250F in the 250 class?

No doubt the 2S makes more HP per cc... but who cares? The 250 & 450 4S are legal. Pick your weapon. It's a great time to be a real racer, look at all the choices!

 

[XRpredator]

. . . Everyone knows that only slow fat guys and woods riders like thumpers . . .

yes we do, AND WE LIKE IT!

 

[kdxtodd]

I can't wait till all the 2-strokes are gone.
250 or 450?
So many choices :(

 

[nephron]

The undisputed fastest MX'er on the planet will ride the 450 this year.

Nope. A KX125.

 

[XRpredator]

easy now, Doc. Until Bubba beats the world at the MXDN, the Leprechaun still holds that distinction.

and I don't even like the guy!

 

[biglou]

The reasons people have trouble restarting their 4-strokes is tuning, technique, or both. Although, like Bruce, I've passed my fair share of stalled 4's when I race, so I got no problem with other peoples poor technique!

 

[marcusgunby]

They just make the wrong noise-its a simple as that!!!!
i call them fast tractors:)

 

[Okiewan]

Well, I needed a new weed whacker... mainly due to this thread and not wanting to keep pre-mix, I got a 4-stroke lol!! And it kicks azz! Runs great, tons of tourque. Runs on the same gas as my TRUCK, bikes... life is good. 2-strokes are dying!
(My confession; it's heaver than the 2-stroke version)

 

[bclapham]

LOL- dont tell me, with all that torque you dont feel the extra weight, and it soaks up bumps better than the old one and in addition, you are planning on running through 2020, by which time it will have 1000hrs and will need a quick tune up and valve job! :) :thumb: :worship:

 

[Okiewan]

yes.
Bruce, you know you are pretty much taking your options away by ranting over 4S's ... you're doing yourself a dis-service bro. Go out, do some laps on the CRF then on a 2S Anything. Try to open up that narrow mind of yours when riding them. That's a lot of money to spend just to wish you'd bought the CRF a week later ;)

I'm sure if you end up with a $S for next season, everyone will forgive all your anti-$S comments. We'll just chock it up to ignorance. (THAT was in jest!! don't piss yourself)

 

[Okiewan]

Oh, and btw, with that extra torque and weight, the weed whacter doesn't try to twist in my hands in the really deep stuff. <-- true!

 

[bclapham]

yes.
Bruce, you know you are pretty much taking your options away by ranting over 4S's ... you're doing yourself a dis-service bro. Go out, do some laps on the CRF then on a 2S Anything. Try to open up that narrow mind of yours when riding them. That's a lot of money to spend just to wish you'd bought the CRF a week later ;)

I'm sure if you end up with a $S for next season, everyone will forgive all your anti-$S comments. We'll just chock it up to ignorance. (THAT was in jest!! don't piss yourself)

OK, you got me Okie- the reason i have been stirring up the pot is almost to force myself into a corner and stay with what i know- ive ridden both the CRFs and they both wipe the floor with my hot rodded 125 and 250s, nothing will touch the rm in corners though but it is fast when held open. but i am not sure if i want a CRF since i dont know i can take the cost and race it! but one thing i dont like about the thumpers that really worries me is becoming a lazy rider, people say the thumpers are easier to ride, i dont think that is necasserily true, you really have to ride them in a special way and its not an overnight thing i dont think.

when the new ones come out, i can probably get an RM250 for a lot cheaper than a CRF- i think both bikes only need bars of choice this year.

sometimes i really wonder if people actually are faster on the thumper or just think they are- heck, is there anyone out there that went and bought one to find their results improve over night????

 

[steve125]

but one thing i dont like about the thumpers that really worries me is becoming a lazy rider, people say the thumpers are easier to ride,

Ha Bruce! no doubt the 2 smokes 125 or 250 are harder to ride and require a higher heart rate while doing so. Riding a 4 stroke makes me feel slow and lazy. The power is boring as heck on the 250, my 144 feels 2x as fast but its not. It's all about sensation, the 250f's feel just like a 250 2 smoke with the PV stuck closed. They are good off the bottom then after that just noise. I will take my 144 over any of the 250f's. The CRF 450 is an awesome bike but it's too slow in the corners for me. Being a 125er i just can't give up on those corners. So for me in a nut shell the 250f's are just too lacking in motor for their weight. The 450 is just too much of everything, so I tried the new 04RM250 and was sold! Suspension like the CRF, turns like a 125 and just an awesome motor. So far all my CRF riding buds that have ridden it have come back with big smiles on their face. Most say it's been awhile since they have been on a 2 smoke and it was a blast. I think too many riders have forgotten too quickly the thrill of a PV opening!!! ;)

 

[bclapham]

where ya been steve??? Me and Marcus have been fighting this one on our own!

 

[Okiewan]

Lol Steve.. you are one of the few my friend. One of the few.

I think you might want to ride a CRF 250 real soon, it pulls to the moon and cuts inside lines big time. It's NOTHING like my YZF. My CRF450 feels much lighter than the Yamaha 250. Hey whatever though. Be sure to keep that 2S, cause they won't be any new ones soon. Rather that's good or bad... you decide.

No doubt getting on a 2-Stroke again is fun, just too much work ;)

I still don't know why all the top (less the man) 125's have dropped the 125's and why the top 250 guys are all going to 450's. I guess they're just lazy.

You guys got serious stroke denial goin on! :joke:

 

[steve125]

where ya been steve??? Me and Marcus have been fighting this one on our own!

LOL Bruce! Ive been having a heck of a time getting on DRN at home. Marcus is having problems to at times. Do you know whats up with that Okie???

Okie, Im a bit embarrased to say it but so far in 04 ive owned and sold a CRF450, CRF250 and KXF250! I really gave it a shot but the 4 bangers and i just don't jive. The CRF 250 is the best over the KXF and if i have kept one that would be it. I agree that CRF250 is much better than the YZF. It must be my style but i perfer the instant power of a 2 smoke. Most people that ride my 144's feel they hit too hard, but that's the way I like it. Pretty much the opposite of a 4 stroke.

BTW the 1 mod i did to the CRF250 was to install a PC low boy full TI system. It rocks pure and simple! one if not the best bolt on gains i have ever felt with an aftermarket anything, ever. More bottom, same mid and more top!!! :thumb:

 

[HiG4s]

just to throw my devalued 2 cents in.. I have found that for me a 2S is more apt to break traction unexpectedly when gassed than a 4S.. But to that effect the 4S is more apt to catch traction and launch unexpectedly when gassed.

I have also found through experience that when I lose traction unexpectedly I tend to lowside but when I catch traction unexpectedly I tend to highside.

Not that I have never highsided or crashed hard on a 2S I just seem to do it move often on 4S. Yet every year I get slower so it may not be as big a deal as it use to be.

 

[fender92883]

my TRUCK

LOL, you just don't quit, do you Okie? I sure hope Pred sees this! :p